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11-17 was a pretty good show. The 15 November 1971 Austin show was better - in my opinion. 11-17 had, in my opinion, exceptional Cumberland and NFA>GD>NFA; above average Truckin’ jam, PITB jam, Big RR Blues, and i guess above average Other One Muncle Other One Wharf.

 

The band sounded rowdy and having a blast...or so it seemed to me...

 

Great to see them releasing these early shows...

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Recently listened to bits of the Rosemont shows from April 89. I wasn't there for the 11th but saw the following two shows (saw Cincy and Louisville too before Rosemont). Surprised at how solid the shows were. Quite possibly my only "To Lay Me Down". I'm struggling to dredge up any memories though. I did get down to 10th row center for a 1st set but really cant recall much else outside of the weather being crappy.

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Trie to grab the forthcoming Dave P 26. Sold Out  :worried 


 


I just read – in the only readable Spanish rock mag, Ruta 66- an interesting journalist piece by maybe the most reliable rock critic here Ignacio Julià – a Wilco fan and Velvet/Lou Reed biographer/fan– on the similarities and differences between the Grateful Dead and The Velvet Underground and the cultural envelopments in both coasts of the two bands in the’ 60. Julià is a huge VU fan and I think that more recently he is also increasingly appreciating the GD (the scarcity of live recordings in Spain, except Europe 72, means that sadly here the Dead are a thing for connoisseurs, even in the rock critic world). I think he is trying to reconcile his old vu passion with a new, acquired passion for the gd. But he fails imho.


 


His thesis is that both bands were not so different, which I find plainly absurd because his major argument is the duration of (some) Sister Ray(s) and Dark Star(s) and the intertwined guitars of Reed-Morrison vs Garcia-Weir. In fact, he interviews fans of both bands – Lee Ranaldo, Ira Kaplan,  M C Kostek (VU Appreciation Society) and Ross James (Terrapin Family Band)- and tries to confirm his feelings in the questions he addresses to them…to no avail.  All interviewees say they do not see any similarity except the banal ones above mentioned. For instance, Kostek says Sister Ray was a conscientiously degenerate delirium that could take any direction while Dark Star was mainly a mystical search…Despite all, he concludes in a large sub headline that “The extremes meet one another”… what would we be without wishful thinking? J - and recommends hearing Fillmore West 1969 vs The Matrix Tapes to assess the thing.  I have to check that VU thing though.


(sorry, no link, and if it would exist it would be in Spanish)

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The only similarity between the GD and the VU, that I can think of, is that they both had a female band member and were both, for a spell, managed by pretty unique and "out there" people (Warhol/Owsley). Not hearing any similar sounds at all.

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Trie to grab the forthcoming Dave P 26. Sold Out  :worried 

 

I just read – in the only readable Spanish rock mag, Ruta 66- an interesting journalist piece by maybe the most reliable rock critic here Ignacio Julià – a Wilco fan and Velvet/Lou Reed biographer/fan– on the similarities and differences between the Grateful Dead and The Velvet Underground and the cultural envelopments in both coasts of the two bands in the’ 60. Julià is a huge VU fan and I think that more recently he is also increasingly appreciating the GD (the scarcity of live recordings in Spain, except Europe 72, means that sadly here the Dead are a thing for connoisseurs, even in the rock critic world). I think he is trying to reconcile his old vu passion with a new, acquired passion for the gd. But he fails imho.

 

His thesis is that both bands were not so different, which I find plainly absurd because his major argument is the duration of (some) Sister Ray(s) and Dark Star(s) and the intertwined guitars of Reed-Morrison vs Garcia-Weir. In fact, he interviews fans of both bands – Lee Ranaldo, Ira Kaplan,  M C Kostek (VU Appreciation Society) and Ross James (Terrapin Family Band)- and tries to confirm his feelings in the questions he addresses to them…to no avail.  All interviewees say they do not see any similarity except the banal ones above mentioned. For instance, Kostek says Sister Ray was a conscientiously degenerate delirium that could take any direction while Dark Star was mainly a mystical search…Despite all, he concludes in a large sub headline that “The extremes meet one another”… what would we be without wishful thinking? J - and recommends hearing Fillmore West 1969 vs The Matrix Tapes to assess the thing.  I have to check that VU thing though.

(sorry, no link, and if it would exist it would be in Spanish)

 

I would (almost) agree with the Weir/Garcia - Morrison/Reed guitar comparisons. I especially notice similarities between Morrison and Weir. Reed & Garcia, not so much. I have observed before, and I think probably here, that I would've loved to hear the Dead cover Sweet Jane and to hear VU cover Franklin's Tower. 

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I see some similarities (some of which are superficial):

 

They were both called the Warlocks

Lou and Jerry both liked Ornette Coleman, and Lou and Bob played with Rob Wasserman

They both experimented heavily with feedback early in their careers

Warhol's Exploding Plastic Inevitable had similarities to the Acid Tests

They both felt like albums didn't capture their live show

 

But feedback aside, I don't hear much in common musically.  Even in their early improvisational noisy jams, the VU were about repetition where the Dead were emphatically not.  

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I see some similarities (some of which are superficial):

 

They were both called the Warlocks

Lou and Jerry both liked Ornette Coleman, and Lou and Bob played with Rob Wasserman

They both experimented heavily with feedback early in their careers

Warhol's Exploding Plastic Inevitable had similarities to the Acid Tests

They both felt like albums didn't capture their live show

 

But feedback aside, I don't hear much in common musically.  Even in their early improvisational noisy jams, the VU were about repetition where the Dead were emphatically not.  

That's a VERY good synopsis.  :thumbup

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Began watching a documentary on Doug Sahm last night (it's available on Amazon Prime)

 

 

Early on, there's a pic of him on stage with Garcia, (it's also in the trailer above) and on his wikipedia page it says that the Dead employed him as a session musician. Anyone know which song(s)/album he appeared on?

 

Edit - found an article with a link to a show from Thanksgiving weekend 1972, in which Garcia and Lesh played in an impromptu band with Sahm in Austin TX.

 

https://aquariumdrunkard.com/2013/11/27/happy-thanksgiving-doug-sahm-and-friends-austin-tx-1972/

 

Actually, that whole show is on youtube too. Rough recording...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Van_3-Sn-n0

 

Found it - Sahm played the Bajo Sexto on Wake of the Flood. Not sure which song(s) though.

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