viatroy

So you want to work just enough to get by and then have the government redistribute the wealth of those that work harder to benefit you even more?

no the point is I'm satisfied without having much. I work to live, not live to work. And the taxes I pay put a whole lot more hurting on me than they do on someone worth millions. For me it just always begs the questions -- how much do you need/wants/gots to have?

I'm suggesting if someone works for 40 hours a week, regardless of what they're doing, they should be able to expect a wage that allows them to feed, shelter and clothe themselves and their families. Even heat their homes. Transport themselves. It blows my mind how middle class folks (say, oh, up to $250,000 in income a year) are so anxious to stick up for the rights of the filthy rich. And I've never understood why regular people think Republicans have their best interests in mind (unless it's the narrowminded social agenda. oh, did I say that out loud? gosh darn it).

And I absolutely believe it is the proper role of government to provide essential services -- and I'm sure our definitions of essential would vary.

Like as in you'd tax the same wealth every year so it eventually whittles down to zero?

yeah, cuz it's just sitting under the mattresses.

What do you think is a fair tax rate for the highest income bracket?

I don't know how I'd set the rate without looking at the demographics.

There's a number that keeps floating around ... something like the richest 400 families in America control as much wealth as the lowest 50? (75? 90?) percent. So I am talking about a wealth surtax too.

 

I wasn't implying that people don't work hard for the money they make. I was merely responding to the quote Obama made to a plumber about spreading the wealth around. On a fundamental level, I don't think that works. I don't think that inspires people to work harder. I don't think that encourages economic growth on a personal level. I don't think that squares with "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

See, I have a little problem with the Protestant work ethic. Why is your life better if you work harder? What are you trying to prove? and to whom? I'm happy to work to have just enough, and spend more of my life doing what I enjoy. It's also why I work for nonprofits -- I feel like I'm contributing something worthwhile, something that's not a widget.

The older I get, the more of a hippy I become.

equality is impossible without social programs.

So it has always seemed to me.

Interesting to see we've taken a page from the Scandinavians in terms of how they resolved their own financial crisis. Might be time to look at the excellent social models they provide too. A very high standard of living, shared broadly, better health indicators, universal health and education, transformation of their energy economies, .... sounds damn good to me. High taxes, so what? The country as a whole benefits, and no one seems to be suffering for it.

I really think our problems stem from the prevailing psyche -- acquisitiveness, an economy based on of pointless consumption, an unhealthy food system, the grasping for all the oil we can squeeze out instead of seeing it for the deadend it is.

There is wealth in the hands of few because, for reasons you may not like, they have earned it in our society.

change happens.

So you want wealth redistribution, from top to bottom, then?

I want a more equitable distribution of wealth -- you may disagree with that politically, and that's okay with me, it's definitely the dominant paradigm. There is enough wealth concentrated in very few hands (and for what purpose?) to allow people at the bottom get paid well enough to enjoy a reasonable standard of living. American productivity, still strong, has created massive wealth at the top, and it's not trickling down. Morton Freidman, Alan Greenspan and their neocon pals have driven this thing into the ground. Time for an major overhaul.

WAMC, the public radio behemoth of the northeast, uses a lot of Wilco in their intro's, etc. They just launched Pieholden Suite (the last instrumental bit) as the official theme music of their 3 hour morning show. They're just giddy for Wilco after the Tanglewood show.

So you make more than $250,000/year?

I'm afraid the "we work hard for ours" argument is bullshit. Everyone works hard for the money -- someone's got to fill all those minimum wage McJobs so that investors can prosper. And that person, who likely has to work a second job, perhaps raise kids while they're at it, after working hard for as many hours as it takes, doesn't have the opportunity to scrimp and save and buy a house and invest what's left -- because there IS nothing left (and no healthcare along the way). The idea that everyone has the opportunity to rise to the top is horseshit -- capitalism needs its wage slaves to transfer to wealth to the top.

Good God man, what issue of The National Enquirer was that story?

 

You know that paper is not all true right?

I will fight you.

Clothespins work for that kind of thing too.

I've got a giant new bag of clothespins, so I think I'm gonna weather the storm alright. And hang my laundry outside.

The first thing that comes to mind is Sid Vicious - Sex Pistols

Gary Oldman was great though.

re Biden; that's shocking. and Sarah Palin was harboring drug dealers in her own home!@!@ OMG!

that's just sick.

Apparently McCain told a crowd of Latinos that their donkey is on fire. Can that possibly be true?

Ack. YouTube is blocked at work. Did I miss anything good?

3 drunken KY rednecks (and a dog) on a four wheeler sharing their insightful political opinion.

very happy birthday flick!

Obama and Biden seem much more gentlemanly by character, more statesmanlike. I think they should stick to it. Now that people are turning to Obama based on a substantial issue, I like to think they'll be turned off by the Rove-inspired hyena attacks.

But then I remind myself of some very bad election nights ... Reagan, Reagan, Bush, Bush, Bush. Of course Bush the elder now seems like a prince compared to his village idiot son.

color me impressed! you can do eet!~~~!!

My husband and I make north of $100K. Here in chicago it never feels like enough.

Wages and prices are definitely much higher in the big cities -- I couldn't do it again. But I'm amazed and appalled at the price of houses even in podunk. When I get near a metropolis, the proliferation of fields of McMansions is what really blows me away. I always drive around asking myself, what do these people do that live in these big ass houses? And who cleans them?

I mostly grew up outside DC, in a plain little 50's ranch house at the edge of the burbs -- which was then Falls Church. I know my folks bought it for like$17K in the early sixties. Same style houses in the same neighborhood were going for $600,000 a couple years ago -- insanity.

Gee, I wonder why people haven't been putting much down on their houses. I meant to say 'gosh darn it.'

Bastille Day

thanks, but no thanks

I'm so lost. I may just hide in the mountains til december. Every media I see seems so slanted, I don't feel like I actually know any of these four people--truly. I certainly haven't heard much in the way of real plans for the future, but what's new?

 

Viatroy, I'm sorry if I got hot under the collar the other night, I've got other baggage that probably fueled me in the wrong direction that evening, and the debate was the breaking point.

 

Everyone please keep the info fueling in--i feel like I find more genuine news here than any trash on tv...

Don't sweat it; I didn't. Alot of fed-up lefties are in the mad-as-hell-and-not-gonna-take-it-anymore mode.

What's July 14th?

I like that word compound . I'm sorta feeling that kind of lifestlye might be in order.

I owned two fairly short-lived goldfish when I was a kid, Hannibal Hayes and Kid Curry. That is all.

Not to get too political, but I was just talking about you with some friends last night!

 

When you coming back through KY?

lucky! I dunno .... I'm job hunting, so not soon. Maybe I'll drag Aman along next time!

Tracy, did you hear Bernie Sanders during the bailout debate? His amendment was basically 'eat the rich'.

 

He is a goddamn hero in my book.

I did, and he made quite the convincing argument. At least the people of VT are well represented.