What Light?

I've been reading the past 4 or 5 pages of this thread and keep seeing Gram Parsons this, and Gram Parsons that. Gram Parsons was one of the leaders in the Country-Rock movement no doubt, but he wasn't doing anything radically innovative. Listen to Buck Owens or Merle Haggard and you'll see the genesis of the country-rock movement. Parsons took those influences and slightly altered them. Also, bands like Buffalo Springfield were doing Rock-Country-Folk influenced music around the same time as Parsons. The first Springfield record came out in 1966, Parsons first record with The International Submarine Band didn't come out until 1967. Does any of these facts make Parsons music any less meaningful? Not in my books. I just hate seeing it implied that Parsons was some musical genius creating something out of thin air. He didn't. Neither does Adams, and maybe Adams is more derivative than Parsons, but that doesn't make his music less meaningful to those that like him. Every band you listen to (for the most part) is influenced by somebody, so what, it shouldn't change the way the music moves or doesn't move you. So what if Adams sounds at times like Parsons, Westerberg, The Grateful Dead, Neil or whomever, if the music says something to you, or the melody hits you in a certain way, or the lyrics affect you, well, that's all that matters. Stop letting music critics define what is good and bad for you and start using your ears.

I own a lot of Buck Owen's stuff ........this is the era(Buck/Merle/Gram etc......) of country/rock that I really enjoy.............Gram is a genius and to many many people he was and is the inventor of country/rock..............

that is nice..........

I dig your passion - but to me GP was a mixture of R&B/country - and I don't hear that on Easy Tiger.

here is one for example...........

automatic disqualification.

yeah that makes sense.............what was I thinking...........like a guy who could sing both rocking and ballad songs...........instead of like one who could only sing rocking ones...........

i have never made a personal attack but i have asked you questions to really understand where you are coming from...yet you have neglected them.

 

all this talk of Gram has reminded me that i need to check him out - what is the best way to go?

on amazon i see a disc of GP and Grevious and then a couple of compilations/box sets.

i am asking sincerely for your opinion here.

thank you..................I have both of his box sets.............the one that includes GP and Grevious Angel with outakes and interviews with Emmylou Harris and Gram about the music(Gram Parsons The Complete Reprise Sessions)..............and the one that includes all the Flying Burrito Brother stuff along with the good hits from the 2 above mentioned albums(Sacred Hearts and Fallen Angels The Gram Parsons Anthology)...........I would choose the second choice...........so you get it all.....you need to have his version of Wild Horses(done when he and Keith R were hanging out a ton) Hot Burrito #1 and his time with the Byrds and The International Submarine Band are included on this one as well............both run around 30 something...............both include Love Hurts...........which is also a must sang with Emmylou Harris...........hope this helps.........

hey, Bon Jovi sells out, who'd think that could happen.

bon jovi to some extent..........still has it..............as much as an 80's hair band can in today's music.............I think van halen has lost a lot over the years mostly due to their constant fighting.............this is good for them if they can truely do it and get along................they were a very good band.............and although I like sammy h more because he knew what a ballad was.................david lee is alright.............

Except for this guy likes Adams, gushes over the record and uses the analogy of Parsons and Adams to positive effect?

 

Yeah, I see that.

I never said it was awful as an album...........I would give it 2/5 stars where he gave 4/5................my point was that it is a blatant rip off of Gram..........which I said 15 pages ago................then many on here along with personal attacks said the album sounded nothing like gram and did not hear that on the album..............I was pointing out that someone who is more knowledgeable than 90% on here about music................heard the same thing I did...............sure he chose influence.............I chose rip off..............but my initial comment was the album was too much sounding like Gram.............he points out on more than one track it does sound a lot like gram....................

wow tons of maturity on here.............turns more into personal attacks.............not really into the Lord of the Flies conch shell battles..............but here we go..............another who thinks like me and is a very well respected album reviewer.......and gee he mentions Gram a few times...............go figure...........

Album Review: Adams, Ryan

EASY TIGER

Adams takes it Easy

By DARRYL STERDAN -- Sun Media

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ryan Adams

Easy Tiger

(Universal)

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Ryan Adams is clearly a guy who can't sit still.

That much is reflected in the title of Easy Tiger (supposedly the words of a more patient girlfriend). But it's equally clear from the rest of his output: Eight albums since 2000 -- three in '05 alone! -- plus assorted online releases and side projects.

But for album No. 9, the prolific alt-country cat and former Whiskeytown leader has changed his stripes. Now 32 and reportedly sober, he's older, wiser and calmer. And he's finally taken his sweet time between discs -- a full 18 months, an eternity for him.

Adams' new laid-back approach pays off handsomely. These 13 mature, melancholy tunes add up to one of the most focused and consistent releases in his scattershot catalog.

If this is what comes from taking his time, we're only too happy to wait a little longer for his next albums.

Goodnight Rose 3:20

If Gram Parsons had written Only Love Can Break Your Heart, it might have sounded like this torchy country-rock waltz. Love the chiming, echoing guitar arpeggios and tinkly piano.

Two 2:38

A downbeat number in every sense of the word, this yearning ballad balances grand piano and guitar with harmonies from Adams and Sheryl Crow. Blue Rodeo should cover it.

Everybody Knows 2:25

An acoustic guitar + a lazy groove + a bittersweet melody and lyrics about love gone wrong = one plainspoken, understated roots gem.

Halloweenhead 3:23

From his bag of tricks, Adams pulls out some beefy, chugging chords, a dragging drumbeat and a tolling bell -- and dishes up the disc's heaviest cut.

Oh My God, Whatever, Etc. 2:31

We move to the twilit backporch for this folksy number flecked with banjo, pretty piano and a world-weary working-man vocal.

Tears of Gold 2:53

Another slow-burning waltz that channels the Nudie-suit spirit of Parsons and his Flying Burritos. "We'll sing you to heaven and back," says Adams -- and he does.

The Sun Also Sets 4:09

The ramshackle gait has faint echoes of The Band's The Weight -- but the big piano and wailing vocal ("We are only one argument from death") are closer to Rufus Wainwright. Stunning.

Off Broadway 2:31

Stephen King recently likened Adams to Neil Young. Tunes like this -- a folksy acoustic-guitar number with a plaintive falsetto vocal and atmospheric percussion -- are why.

Pearls on a String 2:23

The banjo returns -- along with a mandolin -- for this simple, sweet and authentically old-timey bluegrass number.

Rip Off 3:12

A rich piano line drives this sombre roots ballad -- but the piercing guitar licks, gorgeous pedal steel lines and dusty brushed drums complement it superbly.

Two Hearts 3:03

Things get slightly more upbeat musically with some jangly guitars. But Adams' sorrowful Roy Orbison vocal and mushy lyrics ("Three words is all it takes to break your heart in two") tell the real story.

These Girls 2:50

"God bless all the late-night girls," sighs Adams over a gentle acoustic guitar. "When they smile, God ... I get hypnotized." This song has a similar effect.

I Taught Myself How to Grow Old 3:21

A haunting harmonica, a melancholy melody, a mournful vocal and a lush string arrangement make for the best ballad that Neil Young forgot to write.

damn people for having their own opinions about stuff.

funny you should say that considering you have problems with how people post..............and put it on a priority list of things to complain about.............wow a hypocrite too.............you got it all.....................

back to the original post.............yes most of my friends..............probably 75% of them do not like Wilco socially at gatherings or understand them..............it is frustrating..............because what they do choose to play I feel is way under the gods from Wilco..............but like many of their albums this band takes time to grow on people and some people I guess just do not want to take the time.............

odd, some people don't see the big deal about someone starting a thread without back searching the board to the year one (different strokes and all that)

 

still, I was trying to say that solace could change it but hasn't so while annoying as hell (and it is annoying as hell) it seems fair game and probably is better to just petition a mod for a rule change instead of amassing page upon page of bitching about something the guy will keep doing out of spite now anyway. Besides, in his 72 years on the planet he's amassed 600 cds and I'd still like to see the run down of what they are and how they stack up to the 600 or so albums I acquired through various means over the last 18-36 months.

good to see you are mature as well........figures...............anyway..............making a petition because of the way someone posts is a violation of 1st amend. rights pal.................it is what I have done longer than you have owned a computer and what i will do til the end of time...............being immature about it says a lot about you as a person...........it really does...........again.............1st amend rights and individuality.............thought that was what message boards were for................not some communist big brother crap that does not allow differences..............really you are pathetic...............think about what you are complaining about...........

Just because a artist is influenced by another does not make them a thief when it comes to writing songs. Lucinda Williams one of the most prolific songwriters of our generation, on Friday night she called Ryan Adams one of the best songwriters she has ever heard.

 

I think that says a lot coming from her and her history with Gram Parsons and that genre of music.

Emmylou Harris was who worked with him on Grevious Angel and other stuff...............not Lucinda W..............also by the post stating that he is a follower of Gram................I really will retract my comment of wanting to listen to the rest of his catalogue................no need.............they know..........I trust that source..........

don't you see that what you are describing are influences? i don't understand how anyone can think goodnight rose, tears of gold or pearls on a string are blatantly stolen from hearts on fire, ashes or a song for you. while it's debatable but widely believed that gram "invented" country-rock, he didn't invent the melodic waltz sound. c'mon. there are plenty of other artists who play country-rock. there's no copyright on country-rock, at least until metallica decides to go in that direction...

antagonizing what light? priceless...

I gave you examples.................and my reasoning why..........to me if the songs sound that much alike your artist is just hoping here to get away with theft...............now you are telling me I cannot think my original thought and opinion of this album?...............you are a work...........truely.................and a pseudo intellect when it comes to music no doubt...........but thanks for playing today..............

songs #1 goodnight rose..............#6 tears of gold...............#9 pearls on a string.............with their melodic waltz sound is straight from Gram and his grevious angel days in the 70's with songs like hearts on fire..........and his GP days with songs like we'll sweep out the ashes in the morning......... a song for you and how much I've lied..................other tracks have the country rock sound as well on easy tiger...........I would say leaning more towards the rock side...............RA's voice which is no where near the quality of Gram...........does however resemble the sound of hopelessness that Gram made so popular..........no matter what he sang you believed it..............no other has tried to duplicate that until now.........problem is he does not sound as believeable as the original did...........not by a long shot.............but no matter he is obsessively trying to sound like that on this album.............

........................................

also very mature point ................since you asked me so many times for mine...

Defend your fucking opinion with some examples, you idiot.

real mature...........

what light? has 600 cds and is an expert in every musical genre, especially gram parsons - inventor of country rock. Which is apparently why he/she doesn't need to defend his opinions. many people here, myself included, are ignorant and beyond help because we don't think ryan adams stole easy tiger from gram. ryan has a sub-par voice ( ) and his back catalogue is not worth checking out because he can't decide what style he wants to stick with.

 

those are the main points. it's been a fun morning!

for someone people on here call a resident expert on music..............you sure have a comprehension problem.............I said I was going to listen to the rest and form an opinion on each.........guess you missed that............. .............also it is funny I posted other times in other threads and periods were not a problem..............until that is I said an honest observation about the immortal Ryan Adams and his new album...............

can someone give me a brief refresher on what is going on here? i haven't the energy to read through everything, but i want to join in cos it looks interesting.

this is a ryan adams thread discussing his easy tiger album right?..............I heard it a few times through this last weekend and basically formed an opinion about it................that it is a rip off of gram parsons and 70's country rock...............obviously ryan adams can only be praised here...............I have only seen a manic rush of support when someone posted an contrary opinion one other time in music...............when ricky martin left menudo..............that is how all of this got out of hand..............and I have been told..............going against the majority/click here will not make me any friends..............there you should be all caught up..........

oh no!

 

600????????

 

SIX HUNDRED?

 

 

dude, i started buying CD's in '89 (i'm now 29), and at last count (like 3 years ago), i easily have over 2500+ cds/vinyl, which is probably still a small number compared to some people on this forum...

 

and if you counted albums i have in digital form... jeebus...

like I said I am a lot older than you and have vinyl and 8 tracks as well.............many many a box in my basement.............plus hundreds of tapes from that era as well...............my 600 cds are all hard copies purchased from stores not anything downloaded or otherwise...........not a fan of that..........this was not a pissing contest but of course you turned it into one.............missing what my original point was by mentioning 600..............oh well.........

I'm sure you could have a great conversation, there are some great people here well versed in music knowledge and a lot of people especially like alt.country/country rock. Instead you opt to be confrontational and dismissive, which of course won't make many friends.

making friends is not why I am here..............I got enough of those in the flesh.............I have never been about that on message boards and never will be.............. but I am not trying to start wars on here either..............I have a right to my opinion and will always state it when I feel...............as someone who has been around music a long long time(probably older than most posters on here considerably).........I am very knowledgeable about music as well..............I listened to Ryan Adams new album this last weekend 2-3 times through and can honestly say that is how I feel...........I never said it was awful.............I just cannot give it tons of praise and say it is brilliant because to me all it is is an album by a guy with a sub par voice that wanted to go for a Gram Parsons sound.........in the 70's country rock fashion..........I will tell you.............I will make sure I listen to all of his albums.............then I will say my opinion on them no doubt.............objectively...........as I did this one...............believe me I can admit faults with all of my favs musically and listen to others critique of their music............does not see like that is the case with RA..............a shame.............in the big scheme of things...........he is just not that important to make such a fuss about..............

Really? Because the one thing I like about Wilco is you never know what they are going to sound like next. Sure, you can tell it's Wilco because of Jeff's voice, but other than that, there's no way I'd be able to tell YHF, Summerteeth and SBS (just to pick 3) are from the same band.

 

There's no "Wilco sound". It's something you've attributed to them after the fact.

sure they have quirks like 15 minutes of distorted fuzz sound................but to me anyway...............from AM on there is a definite sound that is Wilco................sure there is experimentation here and there...........and a few songs sound nothing like anything they have done before.............but I always know it is Wilco..............and not just because I am very familiar with their records...........but this is not about the brilliance that is Wilco................we all love them ...............I was simply replying to a post about my avatar someone made.............

I have about 800 CDs, and I feel like my musical knowledge is at best fair-to-middling.

my point was I was called close minded and I disagree that someone with so many cds from so many different musical styles and decades could be called this.................someone who appreciates music as much as I do and actually listens to it and discusses it...........and does not use it as just background sound...........has a right to state an opinion about an album being discussed on this message board...........did you really think everyone would post that this album is so wonderful?.............that is the biggest joke of all here..............in order for there to be discussion or continuing converstation there has to be differences in opinion somewhere along the line..........it is fine if people love him..................and it is fine for me to think he is a blatant rip off of GP on this new album Easy Tiger.............that is just the way it will be...............on reference to Sky Blue Sky that someone posted..............sure dueling guitars sound like allman bros on impossible germany.............or vocal harmonies on you are my face sound like crosby stills and nash................but make no mistake about it..............never for a second did I not think that was Jeff Tweedy and the wilco sound as well.............that has been original and unique all along the way through their albums.................

You've implied that an artist should pick a style and stick with it so they can be easily classified (I'm paraphrasing). If that's not what you meant, you should explain yourself. Leaving that implication out there undercuts everything else you've been trying to say, because it makes you look like someone who can't handle music unless you can assign it to little easily labeled boxes, and that would mean that you're as musically closed-minded as the average top 40 listener.

 

You also seem to think that artists shouldn't ever show their influences. That's so patently ridiculous that I shouldn't even have to address it. We never would have had the Beatles or Bob Dylan or the Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin or Wilco if those artists hadn't been trying to make music that sounded like the music they loved. Who are your favorite bands? Do you honestly think those bands don't show their influences at every turn? If you're going to condemn Ryan Adams for being derivative (the oldest, most tired critical clich

Well, it is a message board, after all -- that's a large part of what we have to judge you on. If you've already annoyed people just with the way you type your posts, you're not going to get a lot of slack from the people who read them.

 

Your posting style is right up there with ALL_CAPS SHOUTING in the annoyance department. If you can't see why that's a problem, then to quote you, "you are too far gone."

again if you want to flame someone for an opinion of Ryan Adams like I have about Easy Tiger being GP..............then go right ahead..............it is a message board and what I stated earlier...........however to go after a posting style?..............seems kind of grade school imo..............maybe we could pull people's fingers and discuss the fart noises we hear..............to me that is about the right level..............again I was discussing music ..............and to try and get me to change what I have always done.............won't happen............it is how I post and always will..............let me know when you want come back to music.......

Gram absolutely deserves better than What Light? defending him.

and the way most are on here about Ryan Adams...............you would think he was one of the brothers from Hanson.................

Pearl Jam was all over this topic tonight at Lollapalooza. They even sang a song about it.

PJ always takes the trash out(BP)...............

Reservations