Wallace v. Clinton

[MattZ]

And I refuse to "choose my words wisely"

 

I gotta agree with Edie. I hear what you are saying El El. I really do. Suggesting that we should leave Iraq absolutely emboldens the terrorists. There's no doubt about it. But you know what? We need to leave Iraq. Its just the truth. I think it has to be said -- for everyone's sake.

 

EDIT: I dont know what "speak intelligently" really means. And I dont think critics should have to analyze their word choices to see if they are saying things the right way. No matter what a critic of the administration says, he/she is emboldening the terrorists. So what's the difference?

Edited September 29, 2006 by MattZ

[Edie]

That was a rhetorical question. I'm staying right here. My fantasy is to lead a guerilla army in the Catskills.

 

 

Here's your leader of your guerilla army

 

[bjorn_skurj]

White House press briefing, Sept. 26, 2001.

 

Q As Commander-In-Chief, what was the President's reaction to television's Bill Maher, in his announcement that members of our Armed Forces who deal with missiles are cowards, while the armed terrorists who killed 6,000 unarmed are not cowards, for which Maher was briefly moved off a Washington television station?

 

MR. FLEISCHER: I have not discussed it with the President, one. I have --

 

Q Surely, as a --

 

MR. FLEISCHER: I'm getting there.

 

Q Surely as Commander, he was enraged at that, wasn't he?

 

MR. FLEISCHER: I'm getting there, Les.

 

Q Okay.

 

[Former White House press secretary Ari] FLEISCHER: I'm aware of the press reports about what he said. I have not seen the actual transcript of the show itself. But assuming the press reports are right, it's a terrible thing to say, and it unfortunate. And that's why -- there was an earlier question about has the President said anything to people in his own party -- they're reminders to all Americans that they need to watch what they say, watch what they do. This is not a time for remarks like that; there never is.

[Edie]

how about 'speak intelligently'? cripes.

 

Better, thanks.

 

And I agree that I am certainly not the first person to think this. I am just wracking my brain to come up with a time that we ever have assaulted the US constitution the way that we are now. Possibly WWII, when the internment camps were set up to house japanese-americans.

[owl]

Suggesting that we should leave Iraq absolutely emboldens the terrorists. There's no doubt about it. But you know what? We need to leave Iraq. Its just the truth. I think it has to be said -- for everyone's sake.

 

Unfortunately, with Iraq, I once believed that we owe the Iraqi people- after invading their country and turning their men, women, and children into collateral damage- the dignity of seeing this through until there is peace.

 

However, the reality is that this is only getting worse and we're going to up and leave sometime, probably without peace.

 

We might as well do it sooner before later. If we continue to wait, we're just being negligent with our troops and paying no respect for our soldiers.

 

So many people have already died for our vanity.

 

(And there are other means to solve this problem. Plenty of 'em.)

[bjorn_skurj]

One thing I think we can be proud of is that we're treating American Muslims a lot better than the Japanese-Americans were treated in World War II and the German-Americans in World War I.

[Edie]

Yes. I don't know as much about WWI, but we not only forced Japanese heritage citizens (and non-) to internment camps, we stripped them of their homes, property and business. I believe that reparations were paid, correct?

[EL the Famous]

EDIT: I dont know what "speak intelligently" really means. And I dont think critics should have to analyze their word choices to see if they are saying things the right way. No matter what a critic of the administration says, he/she is emboldening the terrorists. So what's the difference?

 

Again, while I still think that what we say can be used to embolden terrorists...or maybe it's HOW we say what we say, i'm more concerned w/ 'speaking intelligently' on our homefront so you don't embolden the same republican party you're complaining about.

 

it's slinging around the words 'evil' and 'nazi' and 'fascists' and...whatever. do you want to turn those potential voters away from the group that they didn't catch were so awful the first 4 years or scare them/call them stupid to the point where they are so disenfranchised they vote out of spite?! educate them on what's in it in for them, help them see past the 800 lb. gorilla of national security to other issues affecting them as well, don't condemn them for being religious and show them how the party actually aligns w/ their beliefs...and so on.

 

And I agree that I am certainly not the first person to think this. I am just wracking my brain to come up with a time that we ever have assaulted the US constitution the way that we are now. Possibly WWII, when the internment camps were set up to house japanese-americans.

 

again w/ the 'we'...i'm not assaulting anything and my guess is you aren't either. as far as other examples...racial segregation, a woman's right to vote, 1960-1970...we've overcome a lot and i'm optimistic we can again. i've gotta' be, not just for me but my kids.

[Edie]

again w/ the 'we'...i'm not assaulting anything and my guess is you aren't either. as far as other examples...racial segregation, a woman's right to vote, 1960-1970...we've overcome a lot and i'm optimistic we can again. i've gotta' be, not just for me but my kids.

 

I'm the most glass half-full person you will ever meet.

[EL the Famous]

I'm the most glass half-full person you will ever meet.

 

awesome, you just don't sound like it on the subject of politics I guess. but, it is a message board, so yeah.

[anodyne]

german americans were lynched in WWI. new berlin, ohio changed the name to north canton. the anti-german sentiment was far worse than freedom fries (although liberty cabbage certainly replaced saurkraut). the people who got the worst of it in WWI domestically were the socialists and anarchists. they were rounded up in the middle of the night. magazine and newspaper offices were raided and their subscription lists were used to compile lists of enemies that j. edgar hoover and a. mitchell palmer swept up literally under cover of darkness.

 

 

that said, is anyone else saddened/embarassed/sickened by the detainee bill rammed through congress? how does bush roll back habeas corpus? this legislation is patently unconstitutional, but it'll be difficult to get the act before the courts.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

Yes, I've been on a soapbox about it in this thread. It's one of those "What happened to my country?" moments.

[mountain bed]

Yes, I've been on a soapbox about it in this thread. It's one of those "What happened to my country?" moments.

Jorge,you're right on the money.I've been wondering about this alot lately,with all the debate in Congress about 'detainee treatment' & 'warrantless wiretapping'.We need some HOPE dammit!

 

The last few pages here have been intelligent & relatively spite-free.I will always cling to the old cliche' of 'not my country right or wrong,but how to right the wrongs of my country'.