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Bible thumping teenagers

W(TF)

By W(TF),
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austrya

austrya

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He didn't directly, he just hit on two of the major issues that people have with the catholic church. I was defending those issues in particular, the contraceptive issue and the confusing religious teachings. I was using catholicism as an example because I don't know of any other denomination that prohibits the use of contraceptives....

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tblair

tblair

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I'm not saying that my religion is better than anyone else's. I'm just trying to defend it when we're being called religious extremists.

 

I'm quite happy being Catholic but that doesn't mean that it's the best choice for everyone. It's just the best choice for me.

You were trying to defend it before I made the extremist remark, and it wasn't refferring to you (I don't know you) or more moderate religious followers. I think with the example of Ron Luce, extremist isn't an exaggeration.

 

PS... by default though, you must think you're religion is the best, no?

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austrya

austrya

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My first post on this thread was quoting your religious extremist remark.

 

Like I said. I'm quite happy being catholic. For me, yes, it is the best religion in the whole wide world. I wish everyone was catholic but I know it's not that way, and really, I'm ok with it.

 

I just don't like people bashing it when they don't know WHY the church feels the way they do about certain issues.

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tblair

tblair

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My first post on this thread was quoting your religious extremist remark.

sorry, you're right. I got your posts confused.

 

 

Like I said. I'm quite happy being catholic. For me, yes, it is the best religion in the whole wide world. I wish everyone was catholic but I know it's not that way, and really, I'm ok with it.

 

I just don't like people bashing it when they don't know WHY the church feels the way they do about certain issues.

I'm unsure of most things in the world... people who are sure of anything bring out the distrust in me, I can't help it.

 

(I used to be indecisive as well.... but now I'm not so sure...)

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Guest Alan

Guest Alan

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My first post on this thread was quoting your religious extremist remark.

 

Like I said. I'm quite happy being catholic. For me, yes, it is the best religion in the whole wide world. I wish everyone was catholic but I know it's not that way, and really, I'm ok with it.

 

I just don't like people bashing it when they don't know WHY the church feels the way they do about certain issues.

the WHY doesn't really matter. catholicism is full of hypocrites and people who pick and choose which rules they want to follow, and then use the act of contrition to excuse themselves from the half that they don't care to follow. also, you can really only date catholicism back to about 300 ad, so take that for what it's worth.

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alison the wilca

alison the wilca

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the WHY doesn't really matter. catholicism is full of hypocrites and people who pick and choose which rules they want to follow, and then use the act of contrition to excuse themselves from the half that they don't care to follow. also, you can really only date catholicism back to about 300 ad, so take that for what it's worth.

i'm not catholic but that is ridiculous. At what year should a belief system have started to be valid?

 

every belief system has its loonies, every belief system has truths, and every belief system is made of real people (meaning they will never ever be perfect and there will always be hypocrisy). it seems like some people here hate "religion" the same ways in which extremists hate certain rights we have in the US.

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Guest Alan

Guest Alan

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i'm not catholic but that is ridiculous. At what year should a belief system have started to be valid?

 

every belief system has its loonies, every belief system has truths, and every belief system is made of real people (meaning they will never ever be perfect and there will always be hypocrisy). it seems like some people here hate "religion" the same ways in which extremists hate certain rights we have in the US.

 

well catholics in general (if they are truly catholics and believe in what is taught) already hate (or are against) certain rights that we have, or are fighting for, without being extremists. those being abortion, sex before marriage, contraception, gay marriage, etc.

 

i'm sorry, but any religion based on Jesus and the love of Mary the "Mother of God" that started 300 years after this so called prophet existed are just comical to me. the religion should at least have the roots that actually go back to the man they so adore.

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ikol

ikol

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what makes you think that? I'd guess that many are exactly those very same people

 

If someone's going to ignore one teaching and follow another, I would think they'd choose the lesser evil. It doesn't seem logical to not use contraception for religious reasons but then to have no problem having an abortion.

 

It's more like the indoctrination that I worry about. Just because some people in religion say you shouldn't have sex outside of marriage, doesn't mean to say everyone has to agree with it.

 

Exactly. And just because they don't agree with the Church doesn't mean that the Church should change its position.

 

But you do change your rules as the kid grows in age and maturity, right? You tell a 5 year old that bedtime is 8pm, but would you really use that rule for a 15 year old?

 

Yeah, but some rules never change. You wouldn't tell your kids that they can shoot up heroin when they turn 18.

 

PS... by default though, you must think you're religion is the best, no?

 

You don't mind people having religious beliefs as long as they don't think their religion is the best, but if they are religious they must think their religion is the best?

 

the WHY doesn't really matter. catholicism is full of hypocrites and people who pick and choose which rules they want to follow, and then use the act of contrition to excuse themselves from the half that they don't care to follow. also, you can really only date catholicism back to about 300 ad, so take that for what it's worth.

 

So is the flaw in Catholicism or the hypocrites?

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Guest Alan

Guest Alan

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So is the flaw in Catholicism or the hypocrites?

the flaw goes deeper than either of those two. you see, one day a caveman died and the other cavemen felt bad about it so they created this idea of a higher being to make themselves feel better. religion has been around in some form for longer than you can imagine. it's a comfort for people.

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ikol

ikol

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This is getting pretty silly.

 

I'm all about silliness.

 

the flaw goes deeper than either of those two. you see, one day a caveman died and the other cavemen felt bad about it so they created this idea of a higher being to make themselves feel better. religion has been around in some form for longer than you can imagine. it's a comfort for people.

 

Well, I'd hate for people to be comforted! I guess if the alternative to religion is to be a condescending dick to people, then religion isn't all that bad. I'm kind of confused about your stance on imposing beliefs on others, though. You seem to be doing a lot of it for someone opposed to it.

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ction

ction

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I haven't read all of this thread, but as usual I'm in love with ikol. Can someone please summarize the rest of this gibberish for me so I know who to agree/disagree with and whose opinions I should belittle?

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Guest Alan

Guest Alan

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I'm all about silliness.

Well, I'd hate for people to be comforted! I guess if the alternative to religion is to be a condescending dick to people, then religion isn't all that bad. I'm kind of confused about your stance on imposing beliefs on others, though. You seem to be doing a lot of it for someone opposed to it.

i didn't mean to impose anything. believe in any fairytale you'd like. maybe it's hard to express a counter-opinion to religion without coming off as imposing. to me, the alternative to religion is reality.

 

but like i said, please check out anything that Sam Harris has to say on the subject, he's far more articulate than i could ever be on the subject.

 

i particularly like this piece, http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17889148/site/newsweek/ where he is pitted against evangelist Rick Warren.

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Venus

Venus

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Exactly. And just because they don't agree with the Church doesn't mean that the Church should change its position.

Yeah, but some rules never change. You wouldn't tell your kids that they can shoot up heroin when they turn 18.

 

I don't think shooting heroin vs. wearing a condom (for example) is a valid comparison.

My point is: churches can and DO change (or 'reform') over time in response to the changing needs of it's congregation or various other reasons.

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Guest Alan

Guest Alan

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and since we are all on a Wilco message baord, i find these lyrics fitting of the thread.

 

Theologians

They don't know nothing

About my soul

About my soul

 

I'm an ocean

An abyss in motion

Slow motion

Slow motion

 

Inlitterati lumen fidei

God is with us everyday

That illiterate light

Is with us every night

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tblair

tblair

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Exactly. And just because they don't agree with the Church doesn't mean that the Church should change its position.
they have done before when it's suited them. And as times change, a little adaption might not be a bad thing
Yeah, but some rules never change. You wouldn't tell your kids that they can shoot up heroin when they turn 18.
But they'd be old enough to make decisions for themselves, some I might not agree with
You don't mind people having religious beliefs as long as they don't think their religion is the best, but if they are religious they must think their religion is the best? So is the flaw in Catholicism or the hypocrites?
For me it's just as basic a flaw as you can get. I don't 'mind' them thinking anything, it's just flawed, the whole concept.
This is getting pretty silly.
Why is it silly? I'm interested in the debate... we all have the usual choice..
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OOO

OOO

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i didn't mean to impose anything. believe in any fairytale you'd like.

 

Those two sentences do not jive. you are being condescending when you call his religion a fairytale.

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