Tuners -- that important?

[BigWheeledWagon]

So, with all the various guitar restoration projects going on around here, there has been a great deal of talk about replacing tuners. People have expressed preferences for various styles, etc., but so far I've opted to stick with the stock tuners that came with the guitar/neck. Here's my question: do they really make that much of difference or are they really just a matter of aesthetics? I'd love to hear some thoughts about the various advantages of different tuners.

[oceanman]

If it's not a problem, then no big deal, but if your guitar is always out of tune, you might need to consider.

[jff]

I prefer Kluson style open-slot tuners because I find it easier to change strings on guitars that have them. You trim the string to the proper length and then stuff the end down into the tuning post and start winding, which eliminates sharp, pokey string ends from protruding from the tuning post. I also like the way they look. I don't know if they are better at keeping a guitar in tune than other types of tuners.

[lamradio]

In my experience, there are a lot of great guitars that come with not so great tuners. Well at least for Epiphone Les Pauls or other similar models, it's pretty much mandatory to replace the stock tuners with Grovers.

[jff]

In my experience, there are a lot of great guitars that come with not so great tuners. Well at least for Epiphone Les Pauls or other similar models, it's pretty much mandatory to replace the stock tuners with Grovers.

 

Yeah, my Epiphone Casino has tuners that aren't so great. They look nice, but it's more difficult to tune up ad keep the thing in tune than my other guitars.

[Groo]

I don't think one set of tuners makes a big difference vs. any other set of tuners, as long as both sets keep you in tune. It's more of an aesthetics issue than anything else.

[ginandcigarettes]

I like the safe-t-post slyle slotted tuners for my Fenders for precisely the reasons mentioned above. I have a Dano that could not stay in tune, so I swapped its tuners for some Grover mini locking ones. It still really doesn't stay in tune that well, though it's much better than before (I suspect that the strings are getting bound up in the super soft plastic nut -- I'll replace that with bone sometime).

 

Other than those situations, aesthetics.

 

VOODOO ALERT! Some people think that the mass of the tuners has some great effect on tone. Of course, because this is voodoo, the opinions go both ways: more massive tuners take more vibration from the string, reducing sustain; more massive tuners transfer vibration to the neck better, making better tone. I don't believe any of it. If you can hear a difference, more power to you. Of course, adding/subtracting really massive tuners will shift the balance of a guitar towards or away from the neck, especially on really light guitars like Casinos, which you may or may not like; that's probably not voodoo.

 

Another $0.02: Swapping tuners is usually an expensive proposition. If you're having problems staying in tune, I'd try a locking wrap first and see if that improves your tuning.

[FaintingGoat]

VOODOO ALERT! Some people think that the mass of the tuners has some great effect on tone. Of course, because this is voodoo, the opinions go both ways: more massive tuners take more vibration from the string, reducing sustain; more massive tuners transfer vibration to the neck better, making better tone. I don't believe any of it. If you can hear a difference, more power to you. Of course, adding/subtracting really massive tuners will shift the balance of a guitar towards or away from the neck, especially on really light guitars like Casinos, which you may or may not like; that's probably not voodoo.

 

Another $0.02: Swapping tuners is usually an expensive proposition. If you're having problems staying in tune, I'd try a locking wrap first and see if that improves your tuning.

 

I agree with this post, particularly with regard to the weight at the headstock. I prefer lighter hardware like tulip-type Klusons for a vintage look or the mini Schallers that PRS puts on most of their guitars. One of my Rickenbackers came with the larger Grovers and completely threw off the guitar's balance. But my 335 also has Grovers and because it's a heavier guitar there are no balance issues.

 

In my opinion, if you're going for a vintage look you need to use era-correct hardware. But, if the guitar is a player just stick with what works. Most of us have checked out used gear in a store only to be disappointed at a hack job the prior owner did when changing the keys. Unless they don't keep you in tune, I wouldn't change 'em.

[ginandcigarettes]

Yeah, my Epiphone Casino has tuners that aren't so great. They look nice, but it's more difficult to tune up ad keep the thing in tune than my other guitars.

 

Speaking of which, I have a Casino; what kind of replacement tuners are people putting on these?

[In a little rowboat]

Speaking of which, I have a Casino; what kind of replacement tuners are people putting on these?

 

Same for any gibson/epi/fender/whatever, you can never go wrong with grovers, $100 very well spent (lennon put gold grovers on his casino)

 

I understand the aesthetics argument, i have some high ratio klusons i like on my SG because they look cool

 

tone is generally not affected tuners directly--tone and sustain come from the materials of a guitar from the nut down, not above---but good quality tuners are essential to keep the proper tension and break angle on the strings past the nut (the reason for string trees, headstock angle, and various peg heights on tuner machines)...big heavy tuners can certainly weigh down the headstock, making some guitars feel top heavy when playing, but should make no difference on sustain, etc...

 

j