EL the Famous

when did this become a debate on whose worthy of being saved versus whose unworthy of being allowed to live? there is a big difference and it's the sliding scale specfic to that discussion i'm referring to. does that make sense? if you are asking if i think that embryos shouldn't be disposed of, i already answered that as well (no).

to elaborate, it's a moot question...pregnancy is not an 'either/or' scenario like the burning building. if it was question of having the child or the mother dying, then it's an apt comparison.

Exactly why I would never side w/ anybody taking the stance it should be completely illegal to have one. There are always situations that can't have a line drawn right through the middle...black/white, good/bad. I give you props for engaging in the conversation.

if you find abortion to be murder...shut up, keep your head down and just don't get one. awesome. deep, thoughtful discussion on the matter indeed. and the vegetarion analogy would be more weighty if i was eating human flesh or actually slaughtering the animal itself, but whatever. what's your stance on gun control?

I know you didn't say that, thus my disclaimer...but my point was not as much focused on the father, but the view that said 'biological mandate' is not just a question of a woman's body, but a child's as well. also, if there is little to no potential for physical harm/death to the mother...it becomes less of a 'biological mandate' than a (and this will sound rough) a lifestyle choice. i'm hoping your not feeling like i'm attacking you either, you are just intelligently and respectfully engaging in the discussion and i'm responding in kind.

two people having the same overall stance that abortion is murder...one is a christian and one is an atheist...does one person's religious beliefs make it any less viable for you? is your issue w/ the morality or religious connotations to the viewpoint?

You're right, they are very different and my ommision of the unwillful casualties in my point was unintnetional and shortsighted. I actually think we're of the same overall stance relative to the availability of this choice, especially on government's role. Again though, I have to defend my views that: A. There are at least two 'better solutions' than abortion for unwanted children that already exist...not having sex in the first place or (via adoption) turning an unwanted child into a wanted child. I still believe it is every couple's right to make a decision to abort, as long as all oth

The difference between war and abortion, is the person being killed in once scenario has absolutely no say in the matter. While it is our governement's responsibility not to put our soldiers in unwinnable and/or unjustified conflict...those soliders enlisted w/ the understanding they will be putting their life at stake. If you take issue w/ someone making a decision if someone else lives or dies...how is war any different than abortion? Be you Pro-Life or Pro-Choice, you are contradicting yourself. A mother's body rejecting the fertilized egg, is different than a conscious decision made by s

i'm just going to pipe in and say that when you are talking about a 'clump of cells' created by two people, i don't quite undertsand how it is just an issue of the woman's body and a man cannot have any opinion on the subject.

wrong.

that is what he does and it's because he's too busy to read/respond to each and every post...but he'll at least say he'll go back and respond.

Dude, again, that is YOUR opinion and to cast any viewpoint that differs as ridiculous is pompous...which I forgot from your infomercial for Adbusters, is your thing.

so, life begins when one can be claimed on a tax form...poetic. legally, it isn't murder...but on a grander scale, only the parents of said embryo can determine that.

you might want to take a look at the post above that one.

I think, AGAIN, you are determining your personal definition or view of something as fact that needs to be adhered to and embraced by everybody. We considered our sons 'children' the minute we found out they were there.

I don't expect people to refrain from sex until they are ready to rear children...I just expect them to realize the ramifications of nor doing so safely and w/ protection. Outside of rape, I hold anybody accountable for their actions when it comes to this and, then, even if they still find themsleves w/ an unwanted child...there are so many couples looking to adopt. To expect people, in this day and age, to understand the ramifications of unprotected sex is not at all unrealistic. Personally, 2-3 times tops w/ the same partner who was on birth control and my part of the decision would have b

A very scientific way to look at it...but one could challenge, even in the first trimester, that it contributes so, so much to the mother's mind, heart and soul. That even at such and early stage it can cause a woman to recalibrate her life into a more postive tract and provide an increased sense of purpose. I know you aren't saying that a child doesn't matter until it hits the 3-month mark, but I could never have even thought of our sons as 'parasites'. I am pro-choice, but thinki t should be a choice made only when each and every other option has been exhausted.

'Radio Nowhere' can be DL'ed for FREE from iTunes. Not bad...nice little rocker and I would be lying if I didn't immediately think of MIAB when I heard the riff (not that I really care).

Understood, but would you debate the probabality that they make up the largest %...by a landslide? Whether you agree w/ the current immigration laws or not, there are laws. When someone enters this country and resides in it illegally, THEY are doing so w/ the understanding that there is possbility they could be held accountable for breaking said laws and face the penalties (deportation). This is the risk THEY take. If I don't agree w/ a law, decide to break it and then get caught doing so...I understand that I will face the consequences. So, as a result, there are things I just don't do to

does that dude have 'SPARTA' written on the bill of his cowboy hat? if so, let him in...no questions, paperwork or anything else.