Guest Speed Racer Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 God! What an amazing song. The last minute, when the guitars go crazy, is just pure...I don't know. No adjective, it's just kind of pure. Though I've listened to it for a while, it clicked for the first time yesterday. Gosh! Discuss, maybe...? Also, is it bad that while I like Bob Dylan, I've sort of come to think that he's a bit full of shit at times? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
quarter23cd Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Also, is it bad that while I like Bob Dylan, I've sort of come to think that he's a bit full of shit at times?Isn't that part of his charm? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mjpuczko Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Also, is it bad that while I like Bob Dylan, I've sort of come to think that he's a bit full of shit at times? i think you're full of shit Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Speed Racer, the version that Lou does on the "Rock and Roll Animal" live album is no slouch either. Grreat song! Mr. Rain should weigh in on this...he knows VU inside & out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bsr8j Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Speed Racer, the version that Lou does on the "Rock and Roll Animal" live album is no slouch either. Grreat song! Mr. Rain should weigh in on this...he knows VU inside & out. My boss let me borrow that album a couple of weeks ago. I had never heard the live version of Heroin, which is in fact terrific. My boss, on the other hand, has never heard the VU version. Weird. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tapmyglass Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Isn't that part of his charm? I would say so. Bob's bullshit is still better then 90% of the truth thats out there Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 My favorite song of all time. My favorite version that Lou Reed has done live is in the box set he released in the late '80s, Between Thought and Expression, from the late '70s, recorded with Don Cherry (Ornette Coleman's trumpet player). Really jazzy version. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TheMaker Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Definitely one of the most important songs in the rock 'n' roll canon. I saw a doco a few years back about the VU's short-lived '93 reunion, and Lou comments on the song, saying something about how the trick of the thing is in the fact that it's neither a ringing endorsement nor a condemnation of the drug. It's just a song about taking heroin. Amazingly raw stuff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 VU has songs much better - this is just the song they are know for - it is their Stairway To Heaven. I would much rather here a discourse on the most awesome drum pattern in Here She Comes Now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I'll never forget hearing Heroin the first time I heard it (a friend had the album) as a teenager. I remember the place and the day and the impression it made on me. No one had ever written a song like that before (coupled with "I'm Waiting for my Man"); the VU turned rock completely adult. It was a revelation. in fact the entire album was a revelation, with songs about transvestites, drug addicts, S&M, and other adult stuff. It sure blew the lid off of rock as kids music (bye bye Beach Boys). Songs about hard core drug addiction are now common place. Oh sure there were drug songs before Heroin (Cocaine for example, made semi-famous by Dave Van Ronk), but this one really felt like the people knew what they were talking about. The main difference between the VU version and the Rock and Roll Animal version is that the latter version the musicians really know how to play, which may or may not make it better. LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Speed Racer Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 VU has songs much better - this is just the song they are know for - it is their Stairway To Heaven. Haha, it's funny, because I have the entire VU discography - I suppose it should be said also that I really dislike 'Stairway to Heaven.' I had never liked this song until the post I made, though I've owned everything for a little over a year or so*. I never could catch on to this song the way I knew I should. I was bored after a few minutes, but that second guitar finally just SHOCKED me today. I love the way it screeches. 'Stairway to Heaven' still sucks, though. I love Dylan, also. I'd give up someone else's firstborn for Blood On the Tracks, and the 1963-1967 output really can't be outdone. But I am still a bit irked at how much he wanted to be a part of the 'machine' he hated. But I still love him. Haha! * My modus operandi is to 'latch on' to a band/artist and purchase an entire discography having not heard a note of it (Elliott Smith, Silver Jews, VU, Bob Dylan (pricey), Jandek (pricey), O'Rourke, Sonic Youth, Sleater-Kinney, to name a few). Usually, I use my tax refunds to do this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tapmyglass Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 'Stairway to Heaven' still sucks, though. and thats what seperates it from heroin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Haha, it's funny, because I have the entire VU discography - I suppose it should be said also that I really dislike 'Stairway to Heaven.' I had never liked this song until the post I made, though I've owned everything for a little over a year or so*. I never could catch on to this song the way I knew I should. I was bored after a few minutes, but that second guitar finally just SHOCKED me today. I love the way it screeches. 'Stairway to Heaven' still sucks, though. I love Dylan, also. I'd give up someone else's firstborn for Blood On the Tracks, and the 1963-1967 output really can't be outdone. But I am still a bit irked at how much he wanted to be a part of the 'machine' he hated. But I still love him. Haha!* My modus operandi is to 'latch on' to a band/artist and purchase an entire discography having not heard a note of it (Elliott Smith, Silver Jews, VU, Bob Dylan (pricey), Jandek (pricey), O'Rourke, Sonic Youth, Sleater-Kinney, to name a few). Usually, I use my tax refunds to do this. Well, I have heard both of those songs too many times in the last 25 years or whatever. I just think there are better VU songs than that one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Speed Racer Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Well, I have heard both of those songs too many times in the last 25 years or whatever. I just think there are better VU songs than that one. Oh, heck yes! But when 'bad' songs become good to someone, they're worthy of a thread sometimes. It took me forever to like 'Misunderstood,' too, but I was also a freshman in high school, and thought the Old 97's were badass, so I had a ways to go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I have never disliked anything about Being There and it is still my favorite Wilco album. Although, I don't really listen to Wilco anymore. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dannygutters Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 But I am still a bit irked at how much he wanted to be a part of the 'machine' he hated. Dylan didn't hate the machine (I've heard him sing praises of the brill building output several times), he got you to love him by making you think he did. That's how he works, he makes you see what you want to see in your head, like a ninja! Well this is a topic for another thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Speed Racer Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Dylan didn't hate the machine (I've heard him sing praises of the brill building output several times), he got you to love him by making you think he did. That's how he works, he makes you see what you want to see in your head, like a ninja! Well this is a topic for another thread. Hahahaha, I don't really care what this thread is about. See, I know both parts of what you said. The fact that I can listen to Dylan, feel what I feel, and think what I think, is why everything irks me. Geez, being an anthropology major has really messed with my head. God bless fans n' cults. Let 'em rule the earth!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I first really got into rock music when I was about 12. Early on it was the popular stuff of the day (Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, REM), plus some older hard rock stuff (Aerosmith, Zeppelin). I first heard the Velvet Underground when I was 13. I had read some of my musical heros at the time name check them, so I picked up VU, the outtakes set that was released in the '80s. I liked it, but wasn't blown away. But then I was given the Peel Slowly and See boxed set as a gift later that year. The first time I heard "Heroin" my mind was completely blown. And this was in the mid-90s. I can only imagine what it sounded like to people at the time, without the 30 years of VU-influenced music to normalize it. I actually don't really listen to the VU much anymore, but there was a time that it was all I listened to. I know every note they recorded, even now, and I think I'd still consider them my favorite band despite how rarely I listen to them now. It's certainly arguable whether "Heroin" is really their best song, but it is certainly their most important, and I think it sums up better than any other single song. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Speed Racer Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 When I was little, my parents REFUSED to let me watch MTV/VH1. Of all things to ban, that was probably the best, as I was more interested in doing that, then, than sex or drugs (HA!).The first video I ever saw when they were out of the house (that I REALLY recall) was 'Falling In Love (Is Hard On the Kness) by Aerosmith. Not more than two weeks later, I heard it on Steve Dahl's radio show in the car with my mother (a HUGE fan of Steve & Gary - someone back me up on this!) They [Aerosmith] were my first love for WAY too long. I can still recite the lyrics to most of their songs in less than 30 seconds, each. If I could accomplish anything in my life, it would be a catalog of a sample of my generation's musical awakenings - for those that find it important, of course. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I first really got into rock music when I was about 12. Early on it was the popular stuff of the day (Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, REM), plus some older hard rock stuff (Aerosmith, Zeppelin). I first heard the Velvet Underground when I was 13. I had read some of my musical heros at the time name check them, so I picked up VU, the outtakes set that was released in the '80s. I liked it, but wasn't blown away. But then I was given the Peel Slowly and See boxed set as a gift later that year. The first time I heard "Heroin" my mind was completely blown. And this was in the mid-90s. I can only imagine what it sounded like to people at the time, without the 30 years of VU-influenced music to normalize it. I actually don't really listen to the VU much anymore, but there was a time that it was all I listened to. I know every note they recorded, even now, and I think I'd still consider them my favorite band despite how rarely I listen to them now. It's certainly arguable whether "Heroin" is really their best song, but it is certainly their most important, and I think it sums up better than any other single song. I doubt hardly anyone heard that album when it came out. Just like The Flying Burrito Brothers - it was really the muscians of tommorrow that embraced them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I can only imagine what it sounded like to people at the time, without the 30 years of VU-influenced music to normalize it. It's certainly arguable whether "Heroin" is really their best song, but it is certainly their most important, and I think it sums up better than any other single song.See my post above. I did hear it first time out and it did blow my mind (is that my problem??) I would have to agree that Heroin may not be their best song, but it is clearly their most important. I doubt hardly anyone heard that album when it came out. Just like The Flying Burrito Brothers - it was really the muscians of tommorrow that embraced them.We (me and my friends) listened to the FBB when we were in college. We were all about the country.....(gawd....) LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 See my post above. I did hear it first time out and it did blow my mind (is that my problem??) I would have to agree that Heroin may not be their best song, but it is clearly their most important. We (me and my friends) listened to the FBB when we were in college. We were all about the country.....(gawd....) LouieB In 1967 - you listened to this album? At Warhol's insistence, Nico sang with the V.U. on three songs off their debut album, The Velvet Underground and Nico. The album was recorded in one or two days Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Littlebear Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 VU has songs much better - this is just the song they are know for - it is their Stairway To Heaven. Well, I hope you mean in terms of popularity only. Regarding the kind of song, it's totally different stuff, of course. Heroin sure doesn't please to the mainstream like Stairway or say, Yesterday. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cryptique Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 In 1967 - you listened to this album?People did, you know. Not that many, but it's not like VU were completely invisible in the '60s. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Well, I hope you mean in terms of popularity only. Regarding the kind of song, it's totally different stuff, of course. Heroin sure doesn't please to the mainstream like Stairway or say, Yesterday. I ment it is the one song they are known for - if no-one knows who they are, they have probably have heard that song. People did, you know. Not that many, but it's not like VU were completely invisible in the '60s. The Velvet Underground and Nico peaked at # 171 on Billboard Magazine's top 200 charts Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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