Religulous

[Party @ the Moontower]

I went to a SUNY. I paid off my debt before Kurt Cobain was dead.

 

for you!

 

for me..

 

I'm thinking it will be paid off in the year 2050

[bjorn_skurj]

for you!

 

for me..

 

I'm thinking it will be paid off in the year 2050

The downside is that a SUNY degree isn't really worth a lot in the job market, but since I lack ambition, paying more for a flashier degree would have been a waste, frankly.

[Party @ the Moontower]

i finally got a library card yesterday! haven't had one since i was a kid. my wife informed me they have a huge section of graphic novels, so i went and loaded up.

 

Carefull, they can get crazy if you forget to return books now. My credit report was threatened for an inflated late fee I didn't realize I had until numerous crazy libraian phone calls woke me up.

 

I also had to go to jail & court over a $500 dollar late fee for a VHS tape I forgot to return one summer in college. Don't mess with rentals and library books man.

 

The downside is that a SUNY degree isn't really worth a lot in the job market, but since I lack ambition, paying more for a flashier degree would have been a waste, frankly.

 

You can have my degree if you take over payments. I only used it for a day or two. It looks quite nice on the wall.

[austrya]

It's unfair to brag about not having student loan debt & possibly Unamerican not to have any.

 

I don't have any, but then again, I don't have a degree either.

 

I have a library card, but my library sucks. They don't even have any Nick Hornby books.

[Wilco LP #7]

I've always found Maher very smug. I wish someone with more tact was going to the big screen with this, because I don't see him as more of a shit starter than a converter.

[EL the Famous]

Maher was on the Daily Show last night and, while smugly funny as usual, summarized the crux of flick pretty nicely. While he is looking to point out the many absurdities/perils of many organized religions (which I agree there are a lot of), he's stopping short of backing atheism and the implausability of a God/higher power...because, nobody has a definitive answer one way or the other.

 

I'm interested in checking this out, whether I agree w/ everything in it or not.

[myboyblue]

Maher was on the Daily Show last night and, while smugly funny as usual, summarized the crux of flick pretty nicely. While he is looking to point out the many absurdities/perils of many organized religions (which I agree there are a lot of), he's stopping short of backing atheism and the implausability of a God/higher power...because, nobody has a definitive answer one way or the other.

 

I'm interested in checking this out, whether I agree w/ everything in it or not.

 

I didn't see this but that is not his normal stance. He is typically extremely devout in his atheism. Maybe he's been hearing rumblings and shifting position slightly?

 

I love him but do find the hard-nosed atheism/condescension to be a bit much.

[Good Old Neon]

"I'm not an atheist. There's a really big difference between an atheist and someone who just doesn't believe in religion. Religion to me is a bureaucracy between man and God that I don't need. But I'm not an atheist, no." I believe there's some force. If you want to call it God... I don't believe God is a single parent who writes books. I think that the people who think God wrote a book called The Bible are just childish. Religion is so childish. What they're fighting about in the Middle East, it's so childish. These myths, these silly little stories that they believe in fundamentally, that they take over this little space in Jerusalem where one guy flew up to heaven - no, no, this guy performed a sacrifice here a thousand million years ago. It's like, "Who cares? What does that have to do with spirituality, where you're really trying to get, as a human being and as a soul moving in the universe?" But I do believe in a God, yes." - Bill Maher

[EL the Famous]

I didn't see this but that is not his normal stance. He is typically extremely devout in his atheism. Maybe he's been hearing rumblings and shifting position slightly?

 

I love him but do find the hard-nosed atheism/condescension to be a bit much.

 

I heard you say in the introduction that 'Bill Maher says there is no God'' date=' but I don't say there isn't a God. I'm not an atheist because I find atheism to be a mirror of the certainty of religion and I don't like certainty about the next world, because we can't know.[/quote']

[EL the Famous]

Religion to me is a bureaucracy between man and God that I don't need.

 

i can totally understand that and have, at numerous times, been there myself. which is what i get frustrated with in these conversations...there is a big difference between religion (especially of the organized variety) and faith. i take no issue w/ anyone who holds organized religion suspect, but when that traverses into a definitive high ground that it does nothing (or even little) good is ludicrous. i also take issue w/ holding the respective belief system more accountable than the individuals who actually DO bad things in God's name.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

Hockey moms against religious organization.

[EL the Famous]

never really been able to get behind hockey...but could totally get behind a hockey mom.

[kwall]

"I'm not an atheist. There's a really big difference between an atheist and someone who just doesn't believe in religion. Religion to me is a bureaucracy between man and God that I don't need. But I'm not an atheist, no." I believe there's some force. If you want to call it God... I don't believe God is a single parent who writes books. I think that the people who think God wrote a book called The Bible are just childish. Religion is so childish. What they're fighting about in the Middle East, it's so childish. These myths, these silly little stories that they believe in fundamentally, that they take over this little space in Jerusalem where one guy flew up to heaven - no, no, this guy performed a sacrifice here a thousand million years ago. It's like, "Who cares? What does that have to do with spirituality, where you're really trying to get, as a human being and as a soul moving in the universe?" But I do believe in a God, yes." - Bill Maher

i like this answer. i think this is how most people feel. i do take umbrage at his implication that people who believe that the bible is the word of god think that god sat up on a cloud with ink and pen and wrote it. yes, of course, that is childish. but, anyway, that's a small matter, and there's much on which i agree with him here. i might point out that jesus also did not believe in religion. "Religion to me is a bureaucracy between man and God that I don't need" is a statement that could've been spoken by jesus himself.

[Good Old Neon]

El

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

never really been able to get behind hockey...but could totally get behind a hockey mom.

 

 

POTD!

[Artifice]

never really been able to get behind hockey...but could totally get behind a hockey mom.

 

well played sir

[Good Old Neon]

i like this answer. i think this is how most people feel.

 

If only that were true - you might find this interesting.

 

http://religions.pewforum.org/

[EL the Famous]

My answer to that, is that religion and god cannot be so easily separated...

 

cannot be so easily seperated by you. i have no problem in doing so. besides, i made a distinction between religion and faith.

 

...but to say everything occurs according to god

[Good Old Neon]

Where did your idea of god come from

[EL the Famous]

Why is it that your idea of god sounds so similar to others who share the same religion? Is your conception of god your own, or do you simply believe what you believe because you were raised to believe or at some point exposed to a particular belief system?

 

i don't recall ever actually discussing and/or defining my 'idea' of God. like a lot of folks, sure...my belief came about initially through my family. that said, over the years, it's become more founded more on my own experiences and how they've shaped my faith. couldn't you say the same for being indoctrined to certain scientific schools of thought? i'm not really sure how influence from a particular source giving you inspiration for a certain belief is relevant...some tennants still resonate, but a lot of them don't.

 

I don

[Good Old Neon]

i don't recall ever actually discussing and/or defining my 'idea' of God. like a lot of folks, sure...my belief came about initially through my family. that said, over the years, it's become more founded more on my own experiences and how they've shaped my faith. couldn't you say the same for being indoctrined to certain scientific schools of thought? i'm not really sure how influence from a particular source giving you inspiration for a certain belief is relevant...some tennants still resonate, but a lot of them don't.

 

Because outside of a few texts written by man, not a single shred of evidence for the existence of god exists

[Winston Legthigh]

not a single shred of evidence for the existence of god exists.

 

To paraphrase George Harrison, "I see God in every blade of grass"

 

Don't confuse evidence with proof. There might not be proof of God's existence, but for many people, there's plenty of evidence. The evidence lies within one's own interpretation of their experience. For some, it leads to a conclusion of God's existence, for others, it leads away from that conclusion.

[markosis]

I don't really get why people get so hung up on the "creation of the universe". If that is an arguing point, them I'm out of this one. For people to get so bent out of shape about something that we cannot prove or disprove, nor has any bearing on our lives, baffles me. Its about as fickle as arguing about what happens after we die, something else that cannot be proven or disproven, nor has any bearing on our lives.

 

Aside from that, I see alot of folks using the word "god" as a concrete term, as if one could put a singular meaning on it. "God" is so ambiguous, I think its foolish to argue over the existance of "god." I'll say what I said in our last big religion debate, using George Harrison's quote from above: You may see clorophyll and photosynthesis, I may see an unexplainable beautiful thing, but its the SAME THING. Just because we look at it differently and call it different things, doesn't change the fact that its the exact same thing. The same goes for the science vs. religion debate: someone sees 1's and 0's and genetic compounds, another person sees unexplained phenomenon, another person sees something entirely different, but its the same thing. Get over it. I know we all get off by trying to catch he other guy in a lie or a moment of hypocrisy, but in this argument there are no winners, only each beautiful, individual opinion.

[Good Old Neon]

To paraphrase George Harrison, "I see God in every blade of grass"

 

Don't confuse evidence with proof. There might not be proof of God's existence, but for many people, there's plenty of evidence. The evidence lies within one's own interpretation of their experience. For some, it leads to a conclusion of God's existence, for others, it leads away from that conclusion.

 

I could interpret lightning as evidence of god

[EL the Famous]

Don't confuse evidence with proof. There might not be proof of God's existence, but for many people, there's plenty of evidence. The evidence lies within one's own interpretation of their experience. For some, it leads to a conclusion of God's existence, for others, it leads away from that conclusion.

 

yep.

 

Assuming for a moment the universe does have a creator' date=' it would seem to me, the ultimate act of arrogance and hubris would be to believe that we could suppose to know its mind.[/quote']

 

i would agree. that's why i don't claim to know what god's plan is, but i do believe he exists and he has one. as far as sam harris goes...for him to tell me i can't 'take a proper seat at the banquet of human understanding in the present' because of my belief in god is ludicrous, pandering and seems based on that stereotype i forgo all science for blind faith. life is more complex than that and so am i. what an ass.