tblair

There's quite an amusing (well I laughed!) thread on the (only) other forum I spend any time on. It's kind of related... thread here

I'm not just referring to governments though. There was the Christian Crusades, Christian missionarys taking previously unknown diseases to remote places in the world, etc... (don't put too much importance on the examles being Christian...) I don't think the amount of power the 'messenger' has is of any relevance. Who is anyone to tell someone else how to live their life, providing they're not harming anyone?

I think this is getting a little out of context with the original post. BUT..... from where we stand in Europe, and putting in this in the context of how a lot of the world is now percieving America, with George Bush telling us that he hears voices (God I believe is who he says is talking to him) telling him what to do, it IS a bit scary. I'm sure Bush is on the side of 'God's Warriors', and these people do come across as a little more than extreme. For me, any criticism of the Bible thumping teenagers, and more importantly the people who are running the show, is not connected with others wh

they have done before when it's suited them. And as times change, a little adaption might not be a bad thing But they'd be old enough to make decisions for themselves, some I might not agree with For me it's just as basic a flaw as you can get. I don't 'mind' them thinking anything, it's just flawed, the whole concept. Why is it silly? I'm interested in the debate... we all have the usual choice..

sorry, you're right. I got your posts confused. I'm unsure of most things in the world... people who are sure of anything bring out the distrust in me, I can't help it. (I used to be indecisive as well.... but now I'm not so sure...)

You were trying to defend it before I made the extremist remark, and it wasn't refferring to you (I don't know you) or more moderate religious followers. I think with the example of Ron Luce, extremist isn't an exaggeration. PS... by default though, you must think you're religion is the best, no?

What I'm partly saying (and it is 4.30 in the morning here, I'm on a not-very-busy-night-shift, but feeling a little fuzzy around the edges!) is that it takes all sorts. I'm quite happy with people being religious and/or having faith, but I don't go around telling these people that they're wrong. Why do people who follow a religion always think, or know even, that their way is better than anyone else's, my religion/god is better than yours etc. It's not as if you're ever going to agree on one religion, are you? So while you lot carry on your never ending lost cause, the rest of us have to put

This part of your response is very confusing.... what makes you think that? I'd guess that many are exactly those very same people It's more like the indoctrination that I worry about. Just because some people in religion say you shouldn't have sex outside of marriage, doesn't mean to say everyone has to agree with it.

a very odd kind of logic going on here. Nor sure where anyone suggested anything like that. odd again. Has anyone suggested the church or religion was responsible for HIV? ..... just that they could help to slow the spreading of it.

along with rampant HIV infections, and all the misery that that entails, the catholic stance on this seems extreme to me.

yep, and education. And from what I hear about how certain religious factions are influencing education, by attempting - and seemingly succeeding - to stop evolution being taught in favour of creationism, it's a very relevant point.. ta

PS ...and poverty

the way America is often portrayed/percieved here in Europe (along with stories like this one, about 'God's Warriors), I tend to agree.... ...and it's a little bit scary well, that's a whole other thread (possibly). Maybe we need to get to the bottom of why or how there are as many unwanted pregnancies in the first place before we start denying people their rights. I'd start with blaming religious extremists who won't allow contraception, followed by poor sexual/relationship education, often dictated by [confused] religious beliefs.

ok then... just trying to get this straight, there's 'Planned Parenthood' the organisation, and there's 'planned parenthood' the euphamism.... neither are that commonly referred to here in the uk, so I just want to clear things up...?

why's that? 'they' are

there are people that believe in god, follow a religion, etc, and are quite capable of letting others who choose a different path get on with their lives. These 'God's Warriors' (how provocative is that?) however are pretty much as dangerous as anything any extremists we are supposed to believe are the enemy can be. If you think that's being dramatic, then so be it, it's a fairly dramatic world at the moment.....

"We're fighting for those who don't know they have a voice, that are being manipulated by our pop culture indulging in things that, really, they're not mature enough to be thinking about yet," Luce told CNN. no you're not, you want to manipulate and control the very same people you claim to be saving from the music that isn't anywhere near as harmful as people like you are ... dirty, lying, hypocrite..

I imagine the last 2 shows in Dublin could be rather good! Money and time restrictions means I'll have to make do with the one show in Brixton. Having already seeen them a couple of times at the Shepherd's Bush Empire this year (the second night was one of the best shows I've seen by anyone), I feel rather lucky.....

but London is in the uk. They did 2 shows (Shepherd's Bush Empire is often termed a club gig) at a club, in London, therefore they played club shows in the uk... a return visit wouldn't go amiss though

Not sure how reliable the newsletter is. I thought I'd subscribed to it, but wasn't given any news about the last european jaunt. Keep checking in with Wilcoworld is my advice.

sounds like these festivals might be doing some good for Wilco... review here, and here.... Spain's a lovely country...

De Stijl was the one that got me hooked. I think Icky Thump is fantastic. It's funny, as hard as anything (makes 'heavy bands like Metallica sound like marshmallow), lyrics are great..... It makes perfect sense not having a bass player, well not having a band really. Meg does a great job, and the way it is means that Jack can just do whatever he likes. He'll go into another song slap bang from the middle of another one. He ain't the best guitarist in the world, but he knows what works. He gets a great sound (which is something these days), he understands how dynamics work, and live... well it

best band apart from The Hold Steady...... they must have been best then (Wilco, that is...)

review here Again and again, Cline shreds up Tweedy's tunes with his needling, penetrative solos; in "Shot In The Arm", "Side With The Seeds", "Handshake Drugs", even in "Walken", when he waves his lap steel over his head then uses it to machine gun Kotche..... wish I'd gone now...