owl

And all I'm saying is that rising sea levels will probably resolve a long term solution for Miami and Florida's mass transit dilemma, so don't sweat it.

Are you planning to move soon?

I know, dude. On the other hand, isn't most of Florida at sea level? Any chance you're a levee engineer? By the way, and no offense, I'm not sure that you'd be able to see whether I do anything about city planning--or whether I just talk about it on a bulletin board. I am not talking about forcing anything upon anyone. Nature is not liberal or conservative.

I guess by my logic it would be unnecessary.

Which allows us to plan to have more leisure time, but obviously not any kind of sustainable lifestyle.

Sorry if I misunderstood your recent not-wanting-to-brag-bragging. But at least I now have my first satirical thread at ViaChicago. I've only been here for 5 years; I can't believe it took this long.

So it's either slavery or destruction of our natural resources. I can see now that the choice is really easy for you.

I'm not saying that's what I want. I'm saying that's how it will be, drilling or not.

Yes I have on many occasions and I don't disagree with you. I'm just saying that it's not something that people will be able to postpone for much longer. Population densities will increase in some areas, and others will become ghost towns. The rich will continue to do what they do. The rest will have to find a way. And rest assured, you will not hesitate to let us all know how rich you are.

I don't know. Do you want to know what our standard of living is doing for China?

Well, it was. A lot of retirement funds aren't looking so secure anymore.

That's what an artificially-sustained standard of living will do. That's what laziness will do to an economy. It's not because we're running out of oil that this is a problem--it's because we refused to see it coming and instead opted to continue to gratify ourselves while it lasted. It will have to become feasible. Personal, gas-powered automotive transport isn't looking feasible anymore, either, like it or not.

I love the "everyone else is doing it" argument. That's the funny thing about conservatives: they try to claim moral high ground but in an instant will do anything for money. There is no quick solution to this problem. No drilling--and no mass transit systems--will produce instant results. You might as well get used to it. By the time we realize the four-cent benefit of oil drilling along the coasts and in ANWR, we'll already be 10 years into exponential gas prices and it won't make any difference whatsoever. You might as well get off your ass and onto your bike. It's amazing what people wil

Fortunately, lifting the executive order is largely symbolic. A federal law that prohibits drilling is still in place. You have to ask yourself: is it worth it to save an estimated four cents to the gallon, or is it just an excuse for Bush to use an emergency to make oil men richer? Note that Bush never mentions the four cents when he promotes offshore drilling. There are many, many things we could do right now to save gas--that would make a much greater impact than the four cents/gallon that we'll save a decade from now, when gas will probably be $15/gallon. Ride your bikes or walk for

I put a really nice soundboard/audience mic matrix of the Hideout on Owl&Bear, for anyone interested: http://www.owlandbear.com/2008/07/13/hoste...t-july-10-2008/

No, I totally understand. It's really easy to rationalize one's dislike for someone when he/she expects something of you.

Yeah, I didn't realize that he has publicly asked people to sell their homes and buy smaller ones, has refused to donate millions to environmental causes but asked others to do so, condemned the airline industry and said nobody should be allowed to fly, etc. And that he's wrong is a separate point. It's amazing how in science, no experiments are ever made, it's science's policy to always judge hypotheticals as false. Cool.

Ohhhh, I get your point now: because Al Gore's has a large house, he's wrong about climate change. Also, he's wrong about climate change because you've tabulated all of the personal "sacrifices" he's made to help the environment, and you find them to be insufficient.

Ah, that makes sense. The only way to make a sacrifice is to avoid air travel--or at least only fly via biplane.

You make a good point: if climate change is true, then everyone would have to give up travel.

You make a good point: because Al Gore travels by jet, he's wrong about climate change.

Amen.

I don't think the songs on Shepherd are as strong as past efforts, but I also don't think it has anything to do with the more elaborate production.