John Wesley Harding

[Mr. Heartbreak]

I know it's just shameful, but this is a disc I never actually heard in its entirety until I recently acquired it. (I have most of the stuff from before it, and a few more from after it.)

Now that I've listened to it a couple times, I wonder how others rate this album in the massive Dylan canon. Top 5? Top 20? And why do you rank it that high, or that low, or whatever. I'm really, really curious.

[Synthesizer Patel]

It's number 1 for me. It's like nothing else around in 1967. And it marks the start of my favourite period in musical history - the early 1970's (1967/8 to 1974) I also see this album (with regard to that Observer top 50 most influential albums) as one of the most influential of all time along with Music From Big Pink. After those two albums came out, most music changed style pretty quickly and pretty drastically.

[Albert Tatlock]

I wouldn't call myself a great Dylan fan, but I like it alot, if that gives any perspective on the views of an 'average punter'. I have or have had, that, Blood on the Tracks, Desire, Nashville Skyline, an early Greatest Hits type thing, Freewheelin' . I think that someone here recommended it to me a couple of years ago.

And of course, with that first track Bob invented drum'n'bass

[LouieB]

8 and 1/2

 

LouieB

[mjpuczko]

top 5 for me.

 

(blood, bringing it all, john wesley, planet waves, freewheelin')

[DrNo]

It's probably my favorite of his studio albums. I like the twangy stuff.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

Interesting...

 

I will admit right away that I was significantly underwhelmed by it, and will most likely prefer Nashville Skyline when I pick it up (it's next on the list).

 

My first impressions:

Title track: Good opener, but I actually prefer Jeff Tweedy's solo cover of it. How's that for sacrilege?

 

As I Went Out One Morning: Slooow. Hard to keep my attention on this one.

 

I Dreamed I Saw St. Augustine: Interesting take on the I Dreamed I Saw Joe Hill theme, but it seems like a step down from his previous "derivative" works.

 

Watchtower: Again, a good song, but it's been spoiled for me by Hendrix's version, which is so good that Dylan adopted much of its style for his own live performances of it. Hendrix's version > the orginal

 

Frankie/Judas: This one just flat-out bores me, and it's got some painfully bad lines (""Oh, yes, he is my friend," /Said Frankie Lee in fright,/"I do recall him very well,In fact, he just left my sight.") The low point of the album for me.

 

Drifter's Escape: He still performs this often, so I was curious: would it perk me up? Not really. At two minutes or so, it's just too slight to get me anywhere. Maybe it's more "epic" in concert, with an instrumental break or something?

 

Dear Landlord: This is a little more interesting, but still doesn't do much for me. It's not bad, but not my fave.

 

Lonesome Hobo: Also pretty good, kind of feels like it retreads familiar ground from his first couple albums.

 

Poor Immigrant: Also pretty good, but still pretty lightweight.

 

Wicked Messeger: One of the best songs on the album, I think, and still gets played in concert. Even so, it's a far cry from stuff he was doing just a couple years earlier.

 

Down Along The Cove: Not where I want to be.

 

I'll Be Your Baby Tonight: Not a bad little lullaby, but still feels very, very slight, and contains the cringeworthy rhyme "That big, fat moon is gonna shine like a spoon." Listening to this, I think, This is the same guy who referenced T.S. Eliot with "Between the windows of the sea /Where lovely mermaids flow," and he's rhyming moon with spoon? Where's June?

 

Anyway...was there a big backlash when this came out? It seems to be held in very, very high regard, but to me it feels like Dylan was saying/thinking, "Okay, I just put out three of the greatest albums ever made before taking a little break, and now I've got nothing to prove. I'm just going to do what I want," and then proceeded to knock out some fairly easy songs with spare arrangements and simple lyrics. It immediately makes me want to hear the "mindblowing" Dylan of Desolation Row, Visions of Johanna, Baby Blue, Gates of Eden, or even Hard Rain. I like the epic Dylan stuff that builds and builds. Like in Stuck Inside of Mobile - by the time you get to "I knew he'd lost control /When he built a fire on Main Street / And shot it full of holes," your head is ready to explode, and there's still 5 verses left.

 

For the moment, I'd have to rank it below Blonde on Blonde, Highway 61 Revisited, Bringing It All Back Home, Freewheelin', Blood on The Tracks, Desire, The Times They Are A'Changin' or Another Side of Bob Dylan, so it wouldn't crack my top 8. Not saying it sucks, I just was surprised that it didn't grab me at all.

I will give it a third spin when I'm in a mellow music mood and see how it goes.

 

Thanks for the opinions.

[wheelco]

it's my top next to Highway 61

 

but I'm not a Dylan fanatic, though

[rghammo]

I love it but compared to the rest of his catalog, it's near the bottom of my Dylan top 10. Quite a Top 10 though.

[mjpuczko]

heartbreak, frankie lee is one of my fave dylan songs

[Mr. Heartbreak]

heartbreak, frankie lee is one of my fave dylan songs

Ouch. May I ask why? Is it more the music or the lyrics?

[Synthesizer Patel]

Ouch. May I ask why? Is it more the music or the lyrics?

 

The lyrics are incredible. The line you pointed out is a great case in point:

 

"Oh, yes, he is my friend," / Said Frankie Lee in fright / "I do recall him very well / In fact, he just left my sight."

 

That's not just there to rhyme, though you might think it is.

[TheMaker]

I'm a Dylan obsessive, and I just... don't get it. Safely outside my top ten, I must say.

 

Well, okay, I should say that I do get it. As a song cycle, it represents The Old (Weird) America better than just about anything, and it's a wonderful record by any other artist's standards, but as a Dylan album I can't help seeing it as merely standard.

 

There are moments of sublime beauty, to be sure; songs like Frankie Lee and St. Augustine are stunning, but there's also a lot of schmaltz that in my opinion presages the more contentious (and in my opinion virtually disposable) follow-up LP, Nashville Skyline. Down Along the Cove and I'll Be Your Baby, for example, are breezy little songs, but not much more than that.

 

As a document of pre-war America, I think Dylan superseded this album when he gave us Love & Theft five years ago. It's a little more scattershot than JWH, but its musical range and at times irrepressible imagery are a lot more comprehensive and engrossing than anything on this disc. That's my take, for what it's worth.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

That's not just there to rhyme, though you might think it is.

Meaning...?

[LouieB]

Interesting...I should be so working, but what the heck

I will admit right away that I was significantly underwhelmed by it, and will most likely prefer Nashville Skyline when I pick it up (it's next on the list).

Underwhelmed is what people were with this when it came out. It appeared to be a huge step back from Blonde On Blonde.

 

My first impressions:

Title track: Good opener, but I actually prefer Jeff Tweedy's solo cover of it. How's that for sacrilege?

Jeff actually covers this amazingly faithful. I heard him sound checking this in Madison (though I was not in the theater at the time) and I assumed they were playing a tape of dylan.

 

As I Went Out One Morning: Slooow. Hard to keep my attention on this one.

This song has some themes about personal freedom, apropos to his desire to do whatever he wants despite the critics.

 

I Dreamed I Saw St. Augustine: Interesting take on the I Dreamed I Saw Joe Hill theme, but it seems like a step down from his previous "derivative" works. Perhaps, or more about religion actually.

 

Watchtower: Again, a good song, but it's been spoiled for me by Hendrix's version, which is so good that Dylan adopted much of its style for his own live performances of it. Hendrix's version > the orginal Dylan absolutely picked up Hendrix's arrangement, but this quiet accoustic version has much to recommend it, particularly the final verse which is so evocative.

 

Frankie/Judas: This one just flat-out bores me, and it's got some painfully bad lines (""Oh, yes, he is my friend," /Said Frankie Lee in fright,/"I do recall him very well,In fact, he just left my sight.") The low point of the album for me. I agree...kind of a dumb song, but again, the theme of staying out of places you aren't supposed to be has its point.

 

Drifter's Escape: He still performs this often, so I was curious: would it perk me up? Not really. At two minutes or so, it's just too slight to get me anywhere. Maybe it's more "epic" in concert, with an instrumental break or something? These are songs that were written about the time of the Basement tapes, so they reflect a simpler and more staightforward Dyllan

 

Dear Landlord: This is a little more interesting, but still doesn't do much for me. It's not bad, but not my fave. Allegedly about Albert Grossman, but could be about anyone trying fuck you over.

 

Lonesome Hobo: Also pretty good, kind of feels like it retreads familiar ground from his first couple albums. Again, Dylan feeling like an outsider.

 

Poor Immigrant: Also pretty good, but still pretty lightweight. From the outside again.

 

Wicked Messeger: One of the best songs on the album, I think, and still gets played in concert. Even so, it's a far cry from stuff he was doing just a couple years earlier. Patti Smith did a killer version of this on her most recent album.

 

Down Along The Cove: Not where I want to be. Pre-Nashville Skyline. If you don't like this, NS is gonna suck.

 

I'll Be Your Baby Tonight: Not a bad little lullaby, but still feels very, very slight, and contains the cringeworthy rhyme "That big, fat moon is gonna shine like a spoon." Listening to this, I think, This is the same guy who referenced T.S. Eliot with "Between the windows of the sea /Where lovely mermaids flow," and he's rhyming moon with spoon? Where's June? Again, pre-Nashville Skyline...same motivation. This one is better than Cove.

 

Anyway...was there a big backlash when this came out? It seems to be held in very, very high regard, but to me it feels like Dylan was saying/thinking, "Okay, I just put out three of the greatest albums ever made before taking a little break, and now I've got nothing to prove. I'm just going to do what I want," and then proceeded to knock out some fairly easy songs with spare arrangements and simple lyrics. It immediately makes me want to hear the "mindblowing" Dyland of Desolation Row, Visions of Johanna, Baby Blue, Gates of Eden, or even Hard Rain. I like the epic Dylan stuff that builds and builds. Like in Stuck Inside of Mobile - by the time you get to "I knew he'd lost control /When he built a fire on Main Street / And shot it full of holes," your head is ready to explode, and there's still 5 verses left.

 

For the moment, I'd have to rank it below Blonde on Blonde, Highway 61 Revisited, Bringing It All Back Home, Freewheelin', Blood on The Tracks, Desire, The Times They Are A'Changin' or Another Side of Bob Dylan, so it wouldn't crack my top 8. Not saying it sucks, I just was surprised that it didn't grab me at all.

I will give it a third spin when I'm in a mellow music mood and see how it goes.

 

Thanks for the opinions.

 

Okay I interspersed some comments, so it may be hard to read. JWH was so out of character and so out of time that there was considerable backlash at the time. Now it is viewed as one of Dylan's greater albums by some. 1967 was all about rock and this was obviously a folk/nearly country album. But it yielded some great songs (see Baez' album Any Day Now for some good versions of some of these songs) and was followed by Nashville Skyline for which the backlash was worse. If you go back and think about what was released in 1967 and the types of music from that period (the San Fran Scene, Hendrix, lots of guitar rock, etc.) this was revolutionary. But by the time Big Pink came out, people were ready because Dylan had changed the tone. Many of these songs are deeply reflective, not as poetic and more allegorical then previous work.

 

I have always liked it alot, but certainly compared to the big 3 dylan albums it is quite different. It is the kind of album that grows on you over time however.

 

LouieB

[Mr. Heartbreak]

I have always liked it alot, but certainly compared to the big 3 dylan albums it is quite different. It is the kind of album that grows on you over time however.

Well, I'm certainly not going to get rid of it, but like TheMaker, I think it will remain safely outside my top ten. Who knows, maybe in 20 years I'll love it from start to finish...

[Synthesizer Patel]

Actually John Wesley Harding went to #2 in America and #1 in the UK and sold better than any of his previous albums on first release, so there wasn't a backlash at all.

 

Meaning...?

 

Well what I meant was that you think the lyric is just there to rhyme, but it's actually one of the key lines in the song because after Judas Priest has leant Frankie Lee money he has become indepted to the man, the fact that he says

 

"Oh, yes, he is my friend," / Said Frankie Lee in fright / "I do recall him very well / In fact, he just left my sight."

 

This shows firstly that he is calling him a friend - he is indepted to the man, secondly that he suddenly understands the cost this friendship will have on him hence his fright, and finally shows that he won't be able to get out of this because instantly Judas Priest is trying to call in his depts - in fact he just left his sight. But then again, nothing is revealed, so the song says at the end.

[MattZ]

Top 5 for me too. When I first started listening to it, I was never that impressed with it. But the more I listened, the more I picked up on its understated beauty. I also think that people tend to write it off as Americana (cut from the Big Pink mold), but I don't think of it that way. Underneath the twang, there is a driving bluesy force. There is a LOT of foot tapping going on when I listen to that album. Reminds me a lot of Love and Theft actually, but with more of a twang to it.

 

Frankie Lee is fantastic, but much love goes to Drifters Escape and Dear Landlord. I think it is a virtually perfect album. There are many layers to the album, and I didnt fully appreciate it until I was able to get into the middle layer and let the album surround me and infect me. If that makes any sense. I would be interested to hear if your opinion changes in a few months.

 

I'll take:

Highway 61

Blonde on Blonde

Blood On The Tracks

Bringing it all Back Home

JWH

[mjpuczko]

it's also some of his best harmonica work.

 

the lyrics in frankie lee are amazing

[tapmyglass]

I tend to agree with themaker, it's a good album but not my favorite dylan album. there are seven or eight album's I would rank above it. But I love that it's so different then what he had done right before it and different then other artists at the time. Dylan made Highway 61 and blonde and blone and everyone followed and started making bluesy rock/folk records and as soon as his influence is high he disapears and comes back playing acoustic folk and country. Like Dylan said "one must always be in a state of becoming"

[Mr. Heartbreak]

Veddy interesting.

[LouieB]

it's also some of his best harmonica work.

 

the lyrics in frankie lee are amazing

It is very much in the mold of the Basement Tapes, such as Clothsline Saga and that kind of stuff; kinda goofy story song....

 

LouieB

[tongue-tied lightning]

not sure the order

 

Freewheelin'

BOTT

Blonde

JWH

Desire

[mjpuczko]

most of the songs are also very fun to play on an acoustic guitar

[Atticus]

When I was a kid, my dad played the ballad of frankie lee and judas priest to me. Before playing it he described to me how this song had always puzzled him, and told me that if I ever figured it out to let him know. I've been listening to it now for about 25 years or so, and still enjoy it every single listen. as to "figuring it out," as with any Bob Dylan song, well, best of luck with a definitive and unassailable interpretation.

 

The rest of the album doesn't knock me over. I think it has its place in the catalogue, but like several have already mentioned in this thread, I wouldn't stumble over Highway 61, Freewheelin' or Blonde on Blonde to get to it.