glassypeaks Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Maybe Perm can comment on how this works? I have limited info about how this goes down. But, one of my best friends works for The Discovery Channel in Manhattan and all she does is work on integrating products into Discoveries shows. (ie: The kids on a reality show about quintuplets might eat Koshi brand cereal etc.) When it's done well, it is not supposed to be obvious. This marketing technique is extensively used (basically anytime you see a character ask for a product by brand, drink a Pepsi etc) She has an entire department that does this stuff (actually three: one that comes up with ideas, one that contacts and tries to sell the integration to clients (ie: Wilco or Koshi) and one that oversees the logistics and tries to make it fit seamlessly into the show. I thought most of this was pretty common knowledge. I was surprised that previous posts seemed oblivious. I would love to have any additional info about this deal, or hear peoples thoughts about Wilco arriving so hardcore in the mainstream (VW commercials, prime time sitcom etc) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glassypeaks Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 "Not every piece of music used in a TV show is placed there by advertisers, believe it or not. If the use of Wilco was an intentional marketing ploy they would've used something from the current record don't you think, not something from their least popular first record. Also, the use of a Replacements song, a band that isn't even around anymore can't possibly be seen as something stemming from a marketing deal, or maybe I missed something." Sure TV show producers pick soundtracks just because they like the music. It happens all the time. What they don't do is repeatedly say the band name when it is really not necessary and make the band's CD a huge part of the plot. I was also surprised that they didn't use a song off the new album. I think that makes the whole thing more interesting. Anyone have any insight into that? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Serak_the_Preparer Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 "Not every piece of music used in a TV show is placed there by advertisers, believe it or not. If the use of Wilco was an intentional marketing ploy they would've used something from the current record don't you think, not something from their least popular first record. Also, the use of a Replacements song, a band that isn't even around anymore can't possibly be seen as something stemming from a marketing deal, or maybe I missed something." Sure TV shows use pick soundtracks just because they like the music. It happens all the time. What they don't do is repeatedly say the band name when it is really not necessary and make the band's CD a huge part of the plot. I was also surprised that they didn't use a song off the new album. I think that makes the whole thing more interesting. Anyone have any insight into that? If what you say is true, then a) why didn't they mention the name of the new CD? and why would they play a track off AM? These days TV shows are using music to connect with the fans of the show (watch an episode of Scrubs and listen to all the great tunes), so I don't see why this is such a stretch to say the writers were listening to Wilco and put it in the show. Again, they never mention the name of the CD or the label. On a side note, this is one of my favorite shows on right now and when we saw it last night I mentioned to my wife that it would be great fodder for the Wilco board tomorrow. Then I said that it would probably already be on there before the show was over. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glassypeaks Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 "why didn't they mention the name of the new CD?" Prob would have made it way to obvious / obnoxious . I mean this is already fairly new territory just to integrate a band and you have got to be kinda careful not come on too strong. What if they had said "Hey Roger please don't break my new Sky Blue Sky Wilco Album" That would have been over the top. I think that they got as much in as they could without the whole thing stinking. Another example of similar integration was on the Entourage season finale, when Arie is trying to book a flight to Cannes and tells Loyd to call his boy "xxxx" at Marquis Jets. The plot revolves around getting a flight and many prob wouldn't even notice the plug. (I am in the jet business and know someone over at Marquis who confirmed it) in both cases "Marquis Jets" and the "Wilco CD" were crucial in the plots, I just don't think writers do that without a reason I know you hate to think that your fav band is doing what essentially constitutes a commercial on a sitcom, but I think it is pretty clear that this was part of a marketing deal. You raise good questions, and I don't claim to have all the answers. I am an MBA student so I enjoy exploring this topic and would love to hear others insights. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marc Etc Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 I don't think it was placed there. They only actually mention the word Wilco once in the entire show, right? The scene where he breaks it I don't think it's mentioned. Plus, the CD he breaks is just a Memorex CD so it was a burned copy! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gogo Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Another example of similar integration was on the Entourage season finale, when Arie is trying to book a flight to Cannes and tells Loyd to call his boy "xxxx" at Marquis Jets. The plot revolves around getting a flight and many prob wouldn't even notice the plug. (I am in the jet business and know someone over at Marquis who confirmed it) in both cases "Marquis Jets" and the "Wilco CD" were crucial in the plots, I just don't think writers do that without a reasonMaybe I'm naive, but how much extra business is Marquis Jets going to get from a mention like that? I would think not a lot, as their target audience has to be pretty small to begin with, and when you start calculating what percentage of that audience would be watching any given TV show... Isn't it possible that sometimes writers use brand names just for the sake of more realistic dialogue? Rather than saying "I'm really thirsty for some Brand X Cola?", doesn't it sound more realistic for a character to ask for a Coke? I'm not saying that once you get to that point, you wouldn't have Coke and Pepsi competing for that particular mention, but in general I don't think it's all that unlikely that writers might come up with storylines which incorporate mentions of products that they like or are familiar with. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GtrPlyr Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Plus, the CD he breaks is just a Memorex CD so it was a burned copy!I quess the record company was looking to promote Wilco, and illegal copying/downloading. Definitely looks like a paid product placement there . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Atticus Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 foreshadowing of neil patrick harris on a weed run with the girl that just broke up with that other guy that goes horribly wrong... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
the_fliz1 Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I work nights and when I got home from work this morning my wife who watched the show told me about it while we were getting the kids off to school and we actually expounded for about an hour on whether using the promise of listening to a Wilco cd was a good way to pick up girls. I naturally think it is a great pick up line but my wife disagrees. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
napoleon Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 maybe this means NPH will incorporate wilco into harold and kumar 2. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Maybe I'm naive, but how much extra business is Marquis Jets going to get from a mention like that? I would think not a lot, as their target audience has to be pretty small to begin with, and when you start calculating what percentage of that audience would be watching any given TV show... Isn't it possible that sometimes writers use brand names just for the sake of more realistic dialogue? Rather than saying "I'm really thirsty for some Brand X Cola?", doesn't it sound more realistic for a character to ask for a Coke? I'm not saying that once you get to that point, you wouldn't have Coke and Pepsi competing for that particular mention, but in general I don't think it's all that unlikely that writers might come up with storylines which incorporate mentions of products that they like or are familiar with. I don't think a product can be featured on a show without compensation taking place in one form or another. For instance, ever notice that the names of amps and guitars and whatnot are sometimes taped over when you see bands on TV shows. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glassypeaks Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Maybe I'm naive, but how much extra business is Marquis Jets going to get from a mention like that? I would think not a lot, as their target audience has to be pretty small to begin with, and when you start calculating what percentage of that audience would be watching any given TV show... Isn't it possible that sometimes writers use brand names just for the sake of more realistic dialogue? Rather than saying "I'm really thirsty for some Brand X Cola?", doesn't it sound more realistic for a character to ask for a Coke? I'm not saying that once you get to that point, you wouldn't have Coke and Pepsi competing for that particular mention, but in general I don't think it's all that unlikely that writers might come up with storylines which incorporate mentions of products that they like or are familiar with. "Isn't it possible that sometimes writers use brand names just for the sake of more realistic dialogue?" I'm not saying it has NEVER happened, but why would you do for free what someone is willing to PAY you for. We are talking about major corporations that are driven by bottom lines making this stuff. . This is not their first rodeo and they don't leave cash on the table. Brands don't get mentioned just because. With Tivo allowing folks to skip commercials (not to mention you tube etc), they are finding more creative ways to generate ad revenue. Wow, I can't even believe how oblivious to this a lot of people are. "Maybe I'm naive, but how much extra business is Marquis Jets going to get from a mention like that? I would think not a lot, as their target audience has to be pretty small to begin with, and when you start calculating what percentage of that audience would be watching any given TV show..." Yes! Being in the jet-charter biz, I can say for that fact bringing ia very small number of new clients out of the MILLIONS that watched that episode would be worth the cost to Marquits Jets (a Berkshire Hathoway owned company, yes we're talking Warren Buffett here folks) Also it is hard to quantify what the exposure means over time etc. ie:) The fact that we are talking about it now, the cumulative "touches" it takes to make a consumer take action, the cumulative effect of name recognition) The algorithms big marketing firms use are much more complex than.. we spent x dollars and sold y dollars in jet memberships the next quarter. Brand recognition etc is huge! It dds value to the company and is even featured on financial statements as "goodwill" with a dollar value in many cases. Also, they used one of the sales executives real names in the piece. That's pretty black and white.Or was it like you say, just an attempt to make the dialogue more realistic. Give me a break. As for the latter part of your post... You raise a good questio. It's a chicken or egg type mystery. Did the writers in Entourage and HIMYM (new acronyms:) have a situation in their script where they could implement a product integration and THEN sought out the client, or did they talk to Marquis Jets and Wilco (amongst other non-interested parties) first and work it into the episode post-facto? This is a much more informed question and the answer has all types of creative implications. Do a lot of people really believe it's just bc the featured product is "cool" that it gets put into tv shows and movies?. If so, then you are being manipulated all the time and really have no idea. Your choices are not nearly as "free " of choices as you think they are. My Opinion: I believe that movies and tv shows should have to disclose any paid ad integrations in their works. Unfortunantly, this is about as likely as McDonalds agreeing to put calories on their menu boards (there is a big movement to try and accomplish this) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glassypeaks Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I don't think it was placed there. They only actually mention the word Wilco once in the entire show, right? The scene where he breaks it I don't think it's mentioned. Plus, the CD he breaks is just a Memorex CD so it was a burned copy! No, they say at least twice and I am almost positive it's THREE TIMES I could go back and check, but I was looking close and all that I could see of the CD was the reflective bottom. CBS would never promote copywrite infringement of intellectual property. Again, give me a break. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DAngerer09 Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I'm sure the drone from Less Than You Think would have brought in more fans. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Serak_the_Preparer Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 No, they say at least twice and I am almost positive it's THREE TIMES I could go back and check, but I was looking close and all that I could see of the CD was the reflective bottom. CBS would never promote copywrite infringement of intellectual property. Again, give me a break. It definately was NOT a real CD - it was a burned something. I know that for a fact. It was not Sky Blue Sky that Barney broke. I do agree though that they mentioned Wilco at least a few times in the bar, on the phone, and possibly back at the apartment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jules Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Maybe they picked that song because it fit what was going on in the show? Passenger Side? Threesome? And, as Aman said above, Wilco definitely gets compensation for this and has to approve in advance, regardless of who initiated the transaction. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 maybe this means NPH will incorporate wilco into harold and kumar 2.Wilco at GITMO? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gogo Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I don't think a product can be featured on a show without compensation taking place in one form or another. For instance, ever notice that the names of amps and guitars and whatnot are sometimes taped over when you see bands on TV shows.But they never actually mentioned the name of a Wilco "product". Is it the same with just mentioning the name of the band? I'm not talking about using the song, that's different, but just mentioning a band's name, without hyping a specific album or anything? Is that the same thing? I'm not saying it has NEVER happened, but why would you do for free what someone is willing to PAY you for. We are talking about major corporations that are driven by bottom lines making this stuff. . This is not their first rodeo and they don't leave cash on the table. Brands don't get mentioned just because. With Tivo allowing folks to skip commercials (not to mention you tube etc), they are finding more creative ways to generate ad revenue. Wow, I can't even believe how oblivious to this a lot of people are. Yes! Being in the jet-charter biz, I can say for that fact bringing ia very small number of new clients out of the MILLIONS that watched that episode would be worth the cost to Marquits Jets (a Berkshire Hathoway owned company, yes we're talking Warren Buffett here folks) Also it is hard to quantify what the exposure means over time etc. ie:) The fact that we are talking about it now, the cumulative "touches" it takes to make a consumer take action, the cumulative effect of name recognition) The algorithms big marketing firms use are much more complex than.. we spent x dollars and sold y dollars in jet memberships the next quarter. Brand recognition etc is huge! It dds value to the company and is even featured on financial statements as "goodwill" with a dollar value in many cases. Also, they used one of the sales executives real names in the piece. That's pretty black and white.Or was it like you say, just an attempt to make the dialogue more realistic. Give me a break. As for the latter part of your post... You raise a good questio. It's a chicken or egg type mystery. Did the writers in Entourage and HIMYM (new acronyms:) have a situation in their script where they could implement a product integration and THEN sought out the client, or did they talk to Marquis Jets and Wilco (amongst other non-interested parties) first and work it into the episode post-facto? This is a much more informed question and the answer has all types of creative implications. Do a lot of people really believe it's just bc the featured product is "cool" that it gets put into tv shows and movies?. If so, then you are being manipulated all the time and really have no idea. Your choices are not nearly as "free " of choices as you think they are. My Opinion: I believe that movies and tv shows should have to disclose any paid ad integrations in their works. Unfortunantly, this is about as likely as McDonalds agreeing to put calories on their menu boards (there is a big movement to try and accomplish this)Well OK then, you can consider me to have given you a break. Obviously I'm not an informed consumer. Thanks for enlightening me! Oh, and how much is Marquis Jets paying you to hype them on VC? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bobbob1313 Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 But they never actually mentioned the name of a Wilco "product". Is it the same with just mentioning the name of the band? I'm not talking about using the song, that's different, but just mentioning a band's name, without hyping a specific album or anything? Is that the same thing?Well OK then, you can consider me to have given you a break. Obviously I'm not an informed consumer. Thanks for enlightening me!Oh, and how much is Marquis Jets paying you to hype them on VC? That was going to be my next question. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 That was going to be my next question. What was your last one? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bobbob1313 Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 What was your last one? "Why do you hate me?" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
watch me fall Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Wait for it..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ccn103 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 in last night's episode (with the classic crazy/hot girl scale) they ended with "Save It For A Rainy Day" by the Jayhawks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
H.Stone Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 they ended with "Save It For A Rainy Day" by the Jayhawks Ah, love that. 'Round here, that song is called "Sad Marina" by my 4 yr old. I hope the Jayhawks saw a little something for that (vs. being ripped off by VH1 for years with the use of the opening bars of "Blue"). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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