EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 From what then does religion draw it Link to post Share on other sites
Good Old Neon Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Because your beliefs are separate from the book (or any books). The texts are worthy of reading; it's what you draw from them (or not) in your own spiritual journey. Take Jesus' parables. Or the beatitudes. Are you to fully take them literally? Or are you to meditate on them? I think the latter. Your Hitchens says something is thus and so. If it's meaty, and at the moment a bit over your head, do you take him literally or do you meditate (stew, incubate, deliberate, think) about it? If the books are simply novels worthy of reading, where does your belief in god originate? God is born of the bible Link to post Share on other sites
embiggen Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 all of you are going straight to hell. Link to post Share on other sites
Central Scrutinizer Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 It Link to post Share on other sites
Good Old Neon Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 personal faith. we've had the free will argument before and i pose the same conundrum about trying to understand your position. you say you don't believe in a god, but you use the bible and it's flaws as the absolute word of the god you don't believe in. it's the cosmic pie-chart of where responsbility lies for an individual's actions...to the point, sometimes, it seems like you are blaming god or the belief in one for the actions of said extremeists versus the extremists themselves. is your issue w/ the bible, organized religion, any sort of belief in a higher power or all of the above? because, no matter how easy it is to generalize them all together, personal faith cannot be compartmentalized like that. Because I Link to post Share on other sites
Moe_Syzlak Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 You continue to separate religious belief from the book (or books) it is founded upon Link to post Share on other sites
Spawn's dad Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 all of you are going straight to hell. *reported* Because I'm trying to illustrate the myriad contradictions religious belief requires its adherents to swallow. everyone's life, religious or otherwise, is filled with myriad contradictions. Link to post Share on other sites
mfwahl Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 If the books are simply novels worthy of reading, where does your belief in god originate? God is born of the bible Link to post Share on other sites
Central Scrutinizer Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 If the books are simply novels worthy of reading, where does your belief in god originate? God is born of the bible Link to post Share on other sites
austrya Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 The wafers and grape juice are voluntary. Come to the Catholic church. We have blood and flesh. Link to post Share on other sites
MattZ Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 absolutely possible! ... All fair points. We should probably move on because this sidebar is distracting from the larger discussion which appears to be continuing. My one last final point on this, because apparently I can't help myself ( ), would be that if you honestly drill down on the content of what any atheist is saying, whether he says it in an abrasive tone, or an inclusive and moderated tone, is that faith is fucking retarded. So, to be offended when that atheist doesn't sugarcoat it, seems silly to me. You are obviously comfortable with your faith, and that's all that matters. No one that is comfortable with their faith should be offended by what TheMaker or any atheist says, sugarcoated or otherwise. You know before the game even starts what the atheist thinks. The atheist you are speaking to thinks that faith is fucking retarded. Some choose to be gentler in their tone than others. But I'd think a believer would either be offended by both, or offended by neither. Like I've said now several times, I leave open the very real possibility that I am wrong on this. Ok, I'm going to shut up now. Thanks for responding, EL Hyp. Link to post Share on other sites
EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 It Link to post Share on other sites
Central Scrutinizer Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Because I Link to post Share on other sites
EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 All fair points. We should probably move on because this sidebar is distracting from the larger discussion which appears to be continuing. My one last final point on this, because apparently I can't help myself ( ), would be that if you honestly drill down on the content of what any atheist is saying, whether he says it in an abrasive tone, or an inclusive and moderated tone, is that faith is fucking retarded. So, to be offended when that atheist doesn't sugarcoat it, seems silly to me. You are obviously comfortable with your faith, and that's all that matters. No one that is comfortable with their faith should be offended by what TheMaker or any atheist says, sugarcoated or otherwise. You know before the game even starts what the atheist thinks. The atheist you are speaking to thinks that faith is fucking retarded. Some choose to be gentler in their tone than others. But I'd think a believer would either be offended by both, or offended by neither. Like I've said now several times, I leave open the very real possibility that I am wrong on this. Ok, I'm going to shut up now. Thanks for responding, EL Hyp. no worries. that said, i actually do find the use of the word 'retarded' to be slightly offensive and, well, childish. i don't use the word, but whatever. if your schtick is to shock to emphasize your point, i guess you gotta' do what you have to. i'd aslo liek to submit that these discussions hardly come out of anybody evangelizing their belief IN god, but the other way around...w/ one of the reasons behind it being how people of faith push their beliefs on others. that's probably my biggest issue that constantl ydraws me into these conversations. otherwise, i could give a care. the double-standard is too intriguing. Link to post Share on other sites
Moe_Syzlak Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I'm going to assume that my posts draw no comment because they are so right on the money that they require neither response nor affirmation. Link to post Share on other sites
Spawn's dad Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 dude, my religious beliefs...my belief in god...exist because of the myriad contradictions LIFE requires me to swallow. dude, I totally beat you to this Link to post Share on other sites
JUDE Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I'm going to assume that my posts draw no comment because they are so right on the money that they require neither response nor affirmation. That or the vast majority here have your poser agnostic wannbe atheist butt on ignore. Link to post Share on other sites
EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I'm going to assume that my posts draw no comment because they are so right on the money that they require neither response nor affirmation. i haven't read every single one, but i will say the last couple are indeed right on the money. i can completely coexist w/ and actually deeply RESPECT people who don't believe the way i do...it is when their need to prove their or anyone else's beliefs are superior to mine to the point where they need to berate me...fuck that. that's the funny thing...this website is the only place i'm ever put in a place to even have the discussion. i don't like anybody believeing they are above anybody else because of their belief in god anymore than someone believeing they are above anybody else because of their lack of belief in god. clear and simple. a catholic asshole and and an atheist asshole are both...still assholes. Link to post Share on other sites
bobbob1313 Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 What assertions was The Maker making that anyone can refute. It was mostly just opinion or unprovable stuff. Link to post Share on other sites
Moe_Syzlak Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 That or the vast majority here have your poser agnostic wannbe atheist butt on ignore.JUDE = TheMaker? Huh, now it all makes sense. There is a design to the universe! Link to post Share on other sites
EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 to be fair to TheMaker, the bomb queen chick from the comic book he has in his avatar is fucking hot. we see eye to eye there. Link to post Share on other sites
JUDE Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 to be fair to TheMaker, the bomb queen chick from the comic book he has in his avatar is fucking hot. we see eye to eye there. True, and now I know where he gets his material: NSFW This is a declaration of war on the image hero universe! I Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jules Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who in the name of charity and goodwill shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee. Link to post Share on other sites
ikol Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I get the impression that TheMaker would answer "yes" to "Does this dress make me look fat?" and think himself virtuous for doing so. Link to post Share on other sites
EL the Famous Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I get the impression that TheMaker would answer "yes" to "Does this dress make me look fat?" and think himself virtuous for doing so. Link to post Share on other sites
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