Hixter Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 when someone asks for a minimum wage raise or talks about teachers and its under the bus and forget them. When have I ever said that? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Heartbreak Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 My post was entirely what you said about doctors and you pretty much ignored my reply. But thanks for your thoughts anyway.Again, I have worked with doctors, including dentists, for over twelve years. I have no doubt that most of them are more than adequately compensated. When I hear them complain about "Obamacare" (fair to assume that they are not in favor of the Affordable Care Act if they refer to it in the "derogatory Republican talking point" manner), I don't feel sorry for them. I just don't. If they have to fight the insurance companies to get a fair shake, well, welcome to the fucking club. The insurance companies are screwing everybody, not just doctors. If anyone can afford to get screwed by an insurance company, it's a doctor. The people who can't afford to get screwed by insurance companies are the fast food workers, the farmers, the factory workers, the students, those on disability, etc. etc. I was trying to expand the conversation beyond the mere concerns, financial or otherwise, of doctors. My point was that one of the reasons our system is so broken is because multiple parties are complicit. By making health care - which I consider a basic human right, not a commodity like a shirt or a wrench - so prohibitively expensive, the insurance companies, the pharmaceutical corporations, and yes, people like the surgeons who get paid $4,500 per hour, are screwing over the patients. If I never saw a medical bill, I wouldn't know better, but I have, and I do. I'm not saying every doctor is overpaid. I'm pretty sure my GP is not a multi-billionaire. But even my chiropractor has a BMW, so yeah, pardon me if I don't get all choked up about doctors' financial insecurity. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tweedling Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I'm not saying every doctor is overpaid. I'm pretty sure my GP is not a multi-billionaire. But even my chiropractor has a BMW, so yeah, pardon me if I don't get all choked up about doctors' financial insecurity. That made me chuckle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Smith Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Chuckle because chiropractors are not doctors? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jules Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Because BMWs aren't really that expensive? And chiropractors are doctors. Not medical doctors, but still doctors. At least they like to call themselves as such. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Heartbreak Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 When doctors are all driving around in Yugos and VW bugs, then I'll be happy to hear about their financial woes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 There are about 3 years before the primary season kicks off. 2016 election = a solid roster of candidates by summer of 2015 to kiss babies at state fairs = people start making serious noise in time to react to the 2015 State of the Union = 18 months at the most before it's campaign season again. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 2016 election = a solid roster of candidates by summer of 2015 to kiss babies at state fairs = people start making serious noise in time to react to the 2015 State of the Union = 18 months at the most before it's campaign season again. and your point is? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Wow. I thought that was from the most recent page. Don't know how that happened. Either way, we agree on something +/- eight months. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 BTW you see what Jules has done, he deflected the substance (or point) of the letter and went after its humor. It is a perfect analogy of what the GOP is doing, distilled into terms that is easy to understand. I didn't think it was funny either. Not that I was offended, it's just not my brand. And is what the GOP is doing difficult for anyone to understand? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 The figures cited by Hixter and tinnitus photography seem to be what pharma companies spend to make a drug, and not how much it costs to develop a drug. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Wow. I thought that was from the most recent page. Don't know how that happened. Either way, we agree on something +/- eight months. I thought it was really weird you quoted something from nearly a year ago? I just wasn't sure what you were trying to get at. At what point now will the pundits start referring to PBO as a lame duck president. And is what the GOP is doing difficult for anyone to understand? I think a lot of people on the right see what the GOP is doing as something noble or really within the legislative process. Instead they are being petulant little babies who are crying because they did not get their way. Regardless if you think ACA is good or bad, it is a law. It has been upheld by SCOTUS. There are ways to deal with laws, but they are seriously damaging the country. Heaven forbid if we end up not raising the debt ceiling. I shudder when I think about that. I guess there was some sort of meeting held (negotiation?) between the Whit House and the GOP, execpt no members of the TEA party caucus were allowed to attend (per the Speaker). So that is interesting. Don't you think those members who were holding up the government be necessary that they attend. http://huff.to/17Xc1uI Oh to be a fly on the wall at that meeting though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 I think a lot of people on the right see what the GOP is doing as something noble or really within the legislative process. Every single poll suggests otherwise. There was an Onion article to this effect. Now that was funny. http://www.theonion.com/articles/psychiatrists-deeply-concerned-for-5-of-americans,34163/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Every single poll suggests otherwise. There was an Onion article to this effect. Now that was funny. http://www.theonion.com/articles/psychiatrists-deeply-concerned-for-5-of-americans,34163/ The Onion always funny. I guess when I said "...alot of people on the right..." I should have said the right wing talking heads. I drove through Iowa Tuesday mid day (along State Hwy 20 from Dubuque to Sioux City) and all I could find was right wing radio (Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, Huckabee.) From the way they talked it seemed like the GOP was doing God's work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
uncool2pillow Posted October 10, 2013 Author Share Posted October 10, 2013 Make sure you watch Malala Yousafzai on the Daily Show from yesterday. I really want her to receive the Nobel Peace Prize Friday. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jules Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 One thing that cannot be disputed is that the ACA has been a complete disaster so far. I've yet to locate one person who has successfully signed up to even see the coverage options. A complete shit show. The shutdown has drawn attention away from this, which must be nice for the White House. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 By and large the state websites are working fine, according to a NYT article today. But yeah, the federal site is a disaster. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 One thing that cannot be disputed is that the ACA has been a complete disaster so far. I've yet to locate one person who has successfully signed up to even see the coverage options. A complete shit show. The shutdown has drawn attention away from this, which must be nice for the White House. Yeah, I will dispute it. A couple of things, your failure to locate anyone who signed up for ACA has no baring on the law's success. I can find stories where thousands of people have signed up. http://www.komonews.com/news/local/More-than-9400-sign-up-through-health-exchange-226847151.html But even that really has no baring, either. It appears that when states set up their own exchanges the process has gone much smoother. It is those states that have refused to set up their own exchanges that are having problems. The federal website has not gone good. But a website has never gone down because of large amount of traffic. I think they sorely underestimated the amount of traffic. Which begs the point, isn't the fact the website is experiencing so much traffic so at least there is interest in ACA? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jules Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 No. There should be no issues state or federal. They had 3+ years to prepare. It's an embarrassment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Don Draper Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 No. There should be no issues state or federal. They had 3+ years to prepare. It's an embarrassment. Exactly. And the fact that thousands of people are able to sign up should not be a measure of success or pride in a nation where many millions of people could be benefitting from these services. We're talking about a major website failure; no one would be cutting the IRS any slack or remotely characterizing its system as a success if the website crashed or couldn't handle heavy traffic during tax season. States without their own exchanges should not be blamed for the problems of the federal system because, hello, it's a federal law. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tinnitus photography Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 The figures cited by Hixter and tinnitus photography seem to be what pharma companies spend to make a drug, and not how much it costs to develop a drug. no. if it cost 350MM to make a drug, no one would be in business. biotech's a lot more expensive than traditional API mfg, but the price is definitely coming down as processes and yields improve. the big cost is in the clinical trials. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Winston Legthigh Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 The costs to develop a successful drug also include all debts incurred in developing a failure as well. If you're developing 10 drugs, and only one is successful - all the costs associated with the failures are buried into the successful one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tinnitus photography Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 agreed. and i can tell you from personal experience that 1 in 10 wasn't close... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Heartbreak Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Looks like the Republican "brand" is taking the bigger hit for the shutdown, and rightly so:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/09/republican-party-rating_n_4072716.html?ref=topbarHere's hoping some of the Tea Party extremists are swept out of office in 2014, and the Ds and Rs can start working together to make deals again in the future. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Smith Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 No. There should be no issues state or federal. They had 3+ years to prepare. It's an embarrassment.I beg to differ. I work for a large company and we have a software platform that we have invested millions in and almost 15 years and right now it is still not running. Google SAP horror stories for companies who spend huge amounts of capital and time only to fail or launch a shoddy product. K-Mart had their company on the brink of failure over inability to launch their inventory system. And remember the private sector supposedly always does it better. So there is no way you can say that 3+ years is plenty of time to get a system running error free. Also there is an assumption that building the system began immediately . Putting a software project into play is complex and rarely bug free. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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