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Moe_Syzlak

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Everything posted by Moe_Syzlak

  1. Oh I understand what you're saying, it just has nothing to do with my post or point. You seem to be talking about belief systems and how they -- whatever they are -- help one get through life. My point is, in response to jakobnicholas, that we ALL don't start with a belief or faith in god(s). You may feel you did, but I would say it is a learned behavior. But for the sake of discussion, even if you were born with an innate faith in God, not everyone is (I know I wasn't despite being raised Catholic and baptized just like jakobnicholas). Therefore, the presupposition that faith is lost in all c
  2. No offense but I don't know what that has to do with my post you quoted.
  3. I think this discussion is so yesterday, but I just want to point out that this is exactly the reason I presented my thoughts on the issue. Why is faith the starting point and it takes some misfortune to cause someone to lose it? There is no reason to start with faith other than the teachings of those that have raised you. At some point in life, you may feel "touched" by God and that may cause you to have faith. But you weren't born with that. God -- at least our various images of God (god(s) could exist -- I don't know, you don't know and so forth) -- are human creations.
  4. So I thought this was kinda funny. My fiance is an attorney in downtown Denver and she works in a building where one of the tenants is Halliburton (she doesn't work for Halliburton). Today, in preparation for the DNC, the city is removing the Halliburton signs from the building.
  5. Okay, that seems pretty far off from the original point... ... but hey, I'm always up for a drink! Cheers! sweetheart-mine, you can come too!
  6. I am only disputing your characterization of my beliefs, not whether or not god(s) exist. You still do not seem to understand my position. I do not have a belief system that says there is no god(s). There is an inherent difference between that and an absence in the belief of god(s). I merely ask that you not tell me that an absence in the belief of something you can give me no good reason to believe in is in itself an active disbelief in god(s). I'm not saying god(s) necessarily don't exist; I am saying that there is no good reason to consider that they do (for me at least). No more of a good
  7. i don't wanna desecrate my only day to sleep in late.
  8. And to bring this back on topic, I would surmise that is where the bulk of Tweedy's issues with religion come into play. Not just the spreading the "good news," but the idea that those that don't share those beliefs are somehow lesser moral citizens.
  9. Shining Star - The Manhattans (although I personally prefer JGB's version) I Believe - Stevie Wonder Please Be With Me - I like Duane Allman's version Maybe I'm Amazed - Paul McCartney Such great Heights - Postal Service They Love Each Other - GD Ether Sunday - Trey Anastasio This Must Be the Place (Naive Melody) - Talking Heads Falling Slowly - The Frames (or the duet from Once)
  10. Exactly! If you could prove it, it would no longer be faith. But for me (and others) your feeling is not enough for me to base my beliefs around. It is not that I actively disbelieve in god(s), it is that I have no reason to even consider it -- just as you have no reason to consider purple holes or underpants gnomes. Just because it means something to you -- and you believe it -- doesn't mean I have to disprove it in order to not subscribe to it.
  11. I enjoy these discussions and appreciate the civility that has been exercised here so far. AND I respect yours and anyone else's ability to believe what they want to believe. For me, the crux of it comes down to why I should accept as a starting point that god is the raison d'etre. To me, that's a little like saying I believe my computer was built by the underpants gnomes and then dismissing anyone who doesn't share my belief. Someone who doesn't believe my computer was built by underpants gnomes should have no reason to disprove my assertion. Would you agree that faith is at its root an
  12. I think we still must be missing each other. Atheism doesn't sidestep anything (as I said earlier, I am very much concerned with such things). I have no more reason to start from the belief that god is responsible for existence than I do to start from a belief that purple holes in my closet are responsible for them. I think one of the fundamental reasons for a belief in god is to give us some sense that we know the (presently) unknowable - where did we come from, what happens to us when we die. I am okay with pursuing those answers without presently having a hypothesis.
  13. Maybe we are just missing each other's point here. It CAN be a tricky discussion. What I'm saying is when you consider whether or not there are black holes, you accept a premise - however specious it may be to you -- that black holes may, in fact, exist. You may reach a conclusion that they do exist or they don't -- based on evidence, faith, trust in family that raised you to believe they exist.... whatever. BUT, once you accept the premise that black holes may or may not exist, you then weigh the evidence and the burden of proof rests with those that wish to persuade you to believe in black h
  14. Again, you're assuming that faith is central to "the basic questions we ask ourselves." I disagree. I am very curious as to the origins of the universe, what makes us human, what makes me me and you you, etc. I just don't start from the premise that it is a higher power. I see no reason to. You have your faith that that is where you should begin and that is fine. But that is hardly a universal truism and one for which there is a requirement of disbelief.
  15. I do not "believe" there is an absence, since I don't accept the premise. You can call it semantics if you choose. You're right, I don't know and you don't know. The difference is you have faith you know and I don't care about the question. ETA: just to be clear as these sorts of discussions can be misconstrued, I am in NO WAY trying to dissuade you of YOUR belief/faith.
  16. This is not true. The burden of proof is not on the atheist. That would presuppose theism for which there is no support... except faith. It's a circular argument and one which serves little purpose, IMO. If you have faith and it works for you, great! But the absence of faith does not REQUIRE faith. I don't assert that God does NOT exist; I merely do not accept the premise that God DOES exist.
  17. Not Dark Night related, but a nice little story about one of its stars... and I didn't want to start a whole new thread.
  18. I once sat next to Futureman at a concert and he was trying to text, but just couldn't seem to figure it out. That struck me as ironic.
  19. Hmmm, I wonder what Sacramone's ass thinks about being on the same Olympics squad as Michael Phelps.
  20. This just in: people on a Wilco board LIKE Wilco!
  21. *sigh* Case in point. It DOES go both ways. And, if you'll read my post above, you'll see that I don't tolerate the BS from either side and I try my best not only to not perpetuate it, but also to call people on it when I see it.
  22. That's actually wrong. I defend McCain (as does Obama BTW) against unfair attacks. The political discourse in this country is now on par with the lowest of the low Red Sox fans vs. Yankees fans. I will continually point out when I feel like unfair generalizations and dirty politics are taking over. If there is a place to direct scorn, I think it is at the media (as someone who works in that world) for perpetuating much of this. I realized we were lost when when I saw (on MSNBC I believe) a post Gore/W debate focus group asked -- I shit you not -- "who would rather go to a BBQ with?" Is this re
  23. Since this IS the election thread and not about faith, I'll take issue with this point. I would argue that the true "sheep" are the ones that buy that all Obama supporters are falling for some brand of "hope." I watch very little of Obama's speeches and instead focus on his stance on issues. But I will not deny that having a leader that inspires people is not necessarily a bad thing to me. Maybe dig a little deeper than the GOP talking points to understand that informed and well-reasoned voters may have a different view of what's good for America than you do and show some respect rather than
  24. In the first relay Lezak was definitely the hero, but Phelps did his job for sure and Lezak wouldn't have been in position to do what he did had Phelps and the others not kept them close. In the second relay (the 8th gold for Phelps), the U.S. was in 3rd place after Hansen's leg. Phelps's touched nearly a full body length out in first place for Lezak to only need to sustain that lead. Lezak gave up a bit, I think, but still won comfortably. Phelps was clearly the difference-maker in that race, IMO.
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