airtaco Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 To get this a bit off track: LouieB, what Billie Holiday cds/compilations would you reccomend? I don't have anything. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wilco LP #7 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Know what means absolutely nothing? The "rock and roll hall of fame" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twisted Acres Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 LouieB, what Billie Holiday cds/compilations would you reccomend? I don't have anything. I know I'm not LouieB, but this is a great starting point for Lady Day: Great sounding 2-disc set that spans her career. "Body and Soul," one of her later albums on the Verve label, is wonderful as well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WaronWar Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Know what means absolutely nothing? The "rock and roll hall of fame"I'll second that. But since the hall of fame does exist, mine as well comment on its worthlessness. While I was wrong about Sabbeth not being in the hall of fame (forgot to check my facts), who should really be in the hall of fame are The Stooges. Seriously, The Stooges are a huge influential band. For example, they influenced the mid 70's punk movement, the underground 80's, and Kurt Cobain called "Raw Power" one of his favorite albums. Compared to The Stooges, Van Halen, which has left nothing but horrible over-the-top music, does not even deserve to be in the hall of fame. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 There are many lists out there of the bands that could be in the R&RHOF and are not. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ction Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 It will be intersting to see if Black Flag is ever nominated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 "God Bless the Child," baby! Yeah she co-wrote it, but... what a song.You got it......luckily when she did try her hand at songwriting she got it right....To get this a bit off track: LouieB, what Billie Holiday cds/compilations would you reccomend? I don't have anything.The comp that Twisted Acres mentioned looks good to me. His judgement and knowledge on this stuff is flawless. I believe Billie recorded for four labels during her career (there may be more, because jazz musicians often recorded for multiple labels even at the same time....), Columbia, Decca, Commodore and finally Verve. The Columbia sessions are considered by many to be her best stuff, when she was young, playing with Lester Young and other members of the Basie and other bands. The interplay between Billie and Lester is one of the great stories in all of music. Many people are partial to the later stuff on Verve, despite a deepening of her voice due to age, drugs, and cigarettes. I figure you can't go too wrong any which way, but you may want to check out the Columbia sides first, which apparently this set includes. Of course her recording of Strange Fruit on Commodore is something everyone should hear. LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Smith Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I was never a very big fan of Dio. To me that was not Sabbath. I Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I was never a very big fan of Dio. To me that was not Sabbath. I Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Smith Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 At least the dude can sing - although his dungeons and dragons thing gets old after a while. I guess his singing is a matter of perspective. I am no judge of vocal abilities or technical prowess with instruments. But it seems to me that in the 1970's that was one of the arguments against Punk. Oh they can't play or they can't sing. Typically a Yes fan might argue that Steve Howe was technically a better player than...well almost everybody, Alan White or Bill Bruford were better drummers than... Chris Squire could play bass better than... Rick Wakeman or Patrick Moraz were better with Keys than... and John Anderson could sing more octaves than most everyone else therefore yes is better than most other bands. I used to think that way. But I could not help liking what I liked. Sure no one in the Ramones was even remotely qualified to tune, touch or set up a single piece of equipment for any of the guys in Yes, but damned if I didn't like them better in spite of their lack of rock qualifications. Little did I know back then just how hard it is to play as simple and as fast as Johnny Ramone. But I think Dylan and Neil Young sing as well as almost anybody and it is not at all because of their vocal quality. So in a nutshell I guess we have to disagree here as I am not Dio fan when it comes to Black Sabbath. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Uh, I still feel that way. One of the reasons I can't get that much into new stuff is the musicianship factor. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I guess his singing is a matter of perspective. I am no judge of vocal abilities or technical prowess with instruments. But it seems to me that in the 1970's that was one of the arguments against Punk. Oh they can't play or they can't sing. Typically a Yes fan might argue that Steve Howe was technically a better player than...well almost everybody, Alan White or Bill Bruford were better drummers than... Chris Squire could play bass better than... Rick Wakeman or Patrick Moraz were better with Keys than... and John Anderson could sing more octaves than most everyone else therefore yes is better than most other bands. I used to think that way. But I could not help liking what I liked. Sure no one in the Ramones was even remotely qualified to tune, touch or set up a single piece of equipment for any of the guys in Yes, but damned if I didn't like them better in spite of their lack of rock qualifications. Little did I know back then just how hard it is to play as simple and as fast as Johnny Ramone. But I think Dylan and Neil Young sing as well as almost anybody and it is not at all because of their vocal quality. So in a nutshell I guess we have to disagree here as I am not Dio fan when it comes to Black Sabbath. Well put man. One of the things I know I'm guilty of (maybe it's just from growing up in the '70's) is measuring a band's worth by their technical ability. You know, 'that band can't play for shit',etc.. I've got better about that over the years...and certainly being a huge NY w/ Horse fan I can appreciate 'ragged but right' musicianship. In their heyday, Sabbath were routinely criticized for their simplistic,'lunkheaded' sound...but now they're pretty much respected for being fathers of an entire genre of rock music. Go figure... Also, I do consider Sabotage to be the last great Sabbath LP. Side One in particular. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Also, I do consider Sabotage to be the last great Sabbath LP. Side One in particular. "Symptom of the Universe" is a killer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I think Sabbath Bloody Sabbath was the last good one - and Vol. 4 is probably my favorite. Some people think all those Ozzy albums sound the same - but they don't. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
airtaco Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Thanks LouieB and Twisted Acres! I think I'm going to buy the Lady Day set and the Commodore Master Takes and see what happens from there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Thanks LouieB and Twisted Acres! I think I'm going to buy the Lady Day set and the Commodore Master Takes and see what happens from there.Speaking on behalf of Twisted Acres and myself (the old music fans...) you won't be disappointed. When you have digested this material, a dose of the Verve years or the material from the Jazz at the Philharmonic concerts goes along way to giving an understanding of the depth of Billie's singing in her later and declining years; some of the material is heartbreakingly (if that is a word) beautiful. LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twisted Acres Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Louie put it perfectly; her voice and phrasing breaks and melts your heart at the same time. Enjoy! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 She was in prison here in my home state. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lammycat Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Louie put it perfectly; her voice and phrasing breaks and melts your heart at the same time. Enjoy!Although I do appreciate the talents of Billie Holiday, I feel this exact same way in regards to Nina Simone. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Louie put it perfectly; her voice and phrasing breaks and melts your heart at the same time. Enjoy!The strangest juxtaposition of this entire thread is Billie Holiday (an artist I feel you can never hear to much of) with Black Sabbath (a group I can never hear too little of.) I have never really liked BS, although I am certainly not going to suggest others feel the same way. However when push comes to shove, Billie Holiday should be in the RRHOF too, despite being a jazz singer, because countless female and male singers owe her a huge debt for taking some of the most inane popular music (not all of was, but some of it was) and turning it into some of the highest (no pun intended) art of the 20th century. Likewise she also turned some of the most sublime standards into works of unparalleled beauty. Her singing alone has inspired many of the singers we all enjoy whether we know it or not. (In the same way that John Coltrane, Miles Davis, Sun Ra and other jazz figures are major inspirations to rock musicians as well.) (Hell had it not been for Blood Sweat and Tears covering God Bless the Child, I may not have gone back to the original recording anyway. Any chance they are on the ballot sometime?) LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Twisted Acres Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Although I do appreciate the talents of Billie Holiday, I feel this exact same way in regards to Nina Simone. So do I, Lammy... to hear Nina effortlessly go from "Mississippi Goddam" to "Funkier Than a Mosquito's Tweeter" is breath-taking. Despite all the accolades, she is still immensely under-rated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 She was in prison here in my home state.That is quite an honor.... LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lammycat Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 "So do I, Lammy... to hear Nina effortlessly go from "Mississippi Goddam" to "Funkier Than a Mosquito's Tweeter" is breath-taking. Despite all the accolades, she is still immensely under-rated." She's got amazing intonation and phrasing that allows her to make other people's songs her own, too. One of my favorite versions of Dylan's "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues" is by her. Hauntingly heart-felt. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 "She's got amazing intonation and phrasing that allows her to make other people's songs her own, too. One of my favorite versions of Dylan's "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues" is by her. Hauntingly heart-felt.Yea, that is a good one. I havent heard that in years. LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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