aricandover Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 I pick "Crumb-believable" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tongue-tied Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 i've been fooling around with this question in my head since this thread was made, and i think musicians making money in advertising is unhealthy for music. if an artist is passionate about their music, i don't see how they could stand to have a 30 second clip of their song edited and blasted (seeing how commercials try to be as loud as possible) through TV speakers to get people interested in a car or a drink or whatever. on the other hand it seems downright foolish for a smalltime band or artist to turn down money equivalent to more than a year's worth of touring. but in order for the artist to make the rational decision of taking the money, the passion must be compromised, if only for a little bit. we'd all like to see the artist act irrationally, because there's that feeling (if only imagined) that something greater is driving their actions. as artists age we see them finally letting their tunes be used in advertisements, i may be crazy but it makes perfect sense to me that the feeling they had 20+ years back has faded or gone away, and now their wiser selves see cash to be had. and i say "wiser" with no sarcasm at all, Grandaddy (read: Jason Lytle) got $70k for their nonalbum track Nature Anthem. I think he'd have to be a fool to turn it down. Sure, it was a semi-joke song, and Jason split up the dough with his bandmates, so it would seem that nobody's soul has been sold, but there's still something off. Music is all about passion, so I guess I feel that young songwriters/bands of today aren't making enough bad decisions. If they truly believe in the music (which in a universal sense can mean nothing, but to a young adult with a guitar, can mean everything), I can't see them 'selling-out' without spending sleepless nights and really fucking needing the money. If they see their music as just their shot at a game countless others are playing, coldly analysing the ways to profit, what a sad world we now live in. and there's nothing trivial about the uneasiness that comes up on the listener's end either, which has been described several times in this thread. i'm sure most of you are familiar with the Jeff Tweedy-isms on music, you've seen both documentaries and read a few interviews, that he thinks (and i agree with him) that music is equal parts musician/listener. Even if an artist is just picking out notes they'll think people will like and couldn't give a damn about otherwise, a listener might believe in that music quite a bit, they might invest a lot of emotion into a song. so when that song is supplementing McD's new lobster-roll campaign, the listener's feelings are being fucked with. There's been a lot of "it's their music, let them make some money off of it", but i reckon that music is a different from any other profession one could make a comparison to (athletes, moviestars), in that music isn't presented to us, it's shared with us. is it foolish for anyone past the age of fourteen to go crazy over pop music? some may say so, and if you really think about it long enough, yes. but i think a part of what's making the world in general so goddamn gloomy is that anybody with a sign of intelligence is encouraged to rid themselves of passion and be cynical (i don't trust any politician, so let's analyse how electable someone on my theoretical side is and go from there). but while that's now getting a little too dense for this late night ramble, my point remains that i want to see a lot more foolish idealism in rock. i want to see rock bands getting haughty when someone dares place their music alongside pop, as if they weren't one in the same. i want to believe in music made by people who believe in music. i wanna rock! WOO! woo? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Basil II Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Advertisers have gotten LAZY!!!!! Fckers can't write their own shit anymore..... -Robert. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Is artistic integrity automatically comprimised when a song is used in a commercial? What if the commercial is done in a thoughtful, artistic way? True, there is very little truly artistic advertising right now, but hypothetically speaking. What about Jack White's Coca-Cola commercial? It's a pretty good tune, written specifically for the commercial (and not directly about the product). Is something like that different than Iggy selling a 30 year old song? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tongue-tied Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Is artistic integrity automatically comprimised when a song is used in a commercial? What if the commercial is done in a thoughtful, artistic way? True, there is very little truly artistic advertising right now, but hypothetically speaking. What about Jack White's Coca-Cola commercial? It's a pretty good tune, written specifically for the commercial (and not directly about the product). Is something like that different than Iggy selling a 30 year old song? When it's pre-existing music, I'd say the answer is always yes, artistic integrity is compromised, but there are degrees (the lowest being a poverty stricken songwriter selling a throwaway tune to pay his ill-stricken mother's hospital bills, the highest being John Lennon rising from the dead to sell "Imagine" to Walmart for a cozier Pyramid-style tomb, made out of gold). Jack White's Coca Cola advertisement i think presents a different situation. One of the things I thought of before jumping into this thread was other artistic mediums that can translate into a commercial, and I thought of Wes Anderson's credit card commercial, and how that's one of the few commercials i actually got a kick out of. What's selling out in the filmmaker's world? I'd say product placement, but even that can be done in a subtle manner as to not really insult one's intelligence. But that's way too much for me to think about right now. Wes made something separate from his movies, he made the commercial, and it was well done. So can Jack make music specifically for a commercial and do that well and have a clean artistic conscious? Yes, maybe, I think. There's also a problem of association, if we believe in The White Stripes (or the Raconteurs), do we believe in just the music, or do we extend something to the musicians. While it doesn't really bother me, I can see some WS fans feeling uneasy about Jack White having anything to do with the advertising world. I'd like to waste my time more on this, but it's late. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I thought of Wes Anderson's credit card commercial, and how that's one of the few commercials i actually got a kick out of. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
uncle wilco Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Worst song in a commercial = that horrible re-make of "I Walk the Line" for the Levis(?) commercials.yeah, but that chick is hot. the serious look on their faces when the two meet makes me laugh. and you can't take song away from johnny even when it's done by someone else in a commercial because his voice is too memorable and too much a part of the song. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MattZ Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Wow, I had never seen that. What a great commercial. To jump on something mentioned a few posts back -- I dont think its entirely fair to say that as musicians get older (or wiser) they get further away from the passions of their youth and it is easier to sell their music to the Man. That may be partly true, sure, but its also true that musicians from the 50s/60s were regularly hosed by record companies and managers to a tremendous extent and signed the rights away to songs that would have had them be millionaires by now. So in lots of cases, artists (older ones at least) are often trying to get a little love for themselves. Totally understandable and reasonable in my mind. Although I do agree with your general premise that it hurts to be a fan when this happens since music is shared and cherished by fans. And songs, for better or worse, develop an association with times in your life -- whether those associations are a old girlfriend or a summer from long ago or the McDonald's lobster roll ad that aired a few weeks ago. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 On the flip side of all this, I never heard 'Sittin On the Dock of the Bay' before I was 10 and it was in a Hires root beer ad. I used to look forward to that commercial coming on and got the warmest feeling whenever I saw it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lammycat Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I heard Hendrix' "Fire" last night on a commercial for some cell phone. He's a sell-out. SS makes a good point about hearing "Dock of the Bay" as a kid and digging the tune. I'm willing to bet Hires sold a few extra root beers to at least one kid back then. Plus, Otis gained a fan. Then again, maybe another kid stopped drinking Hires because they did not like that tune.... I still think musicians get the short end of the stick when they get dumped on for trying to maximize their profit on their art by selling it for commercials. Just about any other type of artist seems to be given a free pass in terms of going commerial. People don't say they're tainted or put off by Doritos because they never like Jason Alexander, or that Peyton Manning "sold-out" because he pimps cell phones. I guess people get conflicted over this so much is because we tend to take our music personally. We don't like to have images (direct or indirect) forced into our perceptions of what fits certain tunes that we like. This is of course understandable, but I can't fault the musicians for doing it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sir Stewart Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 The Sky Blue Sky tracklisting thread just reminded me of something I never have seen discussed here on VC: how do people feel about Tweedy's appearance in an Apple iTunes ad all those years ago? It was 1999 I think and it's not on youtube, far as I can search. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IrishMickyWard Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 new here, but my 2 cents... I agree when it hurts when you see a favorite song on a TV ad or radio jingle, but more often than not I hear new music - songs that might I not be exposed to otherwise. If I see an ad, tv show, or movie with a 'catchy' song that I am not familiar with I instantly go the the message board at adtunes.com (wonderful site for ad/tv/movie music info) and look it up then head over to Itunes and drop $1. some of the stuff that site led me too: Somewhere Over the Rainbow by Isreal Kamakawiwo'oleIt Must Be Love by MadnessAlive & Amplified by The Mooney SuzukiIce Cream by New Young Pony ClubDe l'alouette by RJD2Remind Me by RoyksoppPunkrocker by Teddybears (featuring Iggy Pop) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tongue-tied Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 i liked the camera ad with the Kinks "picturebook" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Analogman Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I heard Hendrix' "Fire" last night on a commercial for some cell phone. He's a sell-out. Not him - his step-sister who now runs the company. They are also making some sort of sports drink and they have also sold wine with his name on it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I remember a commercial for something (was it HP invent?) that had the intro to "War On War" playing in the background. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 i liked the camera ad with the Kinks "picturebook" Me too. Very good use of that song. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
uncle wilco Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 i liked the camera ad with the Kinks "picturebook"i liked it the first 100 times i heard it. but on the 101st, it began to grate on me. overexposure, for me is really the only problem i have with songs in ads. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bjorn_skurj Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 i liked the camera ad with the Kinks "picturebook"That ad caused me to go out and buy three Kinks CD. HP shit sucks, so I would never buy any of their crap. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MattZ Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Me too. Very good use of that song. Notwithstanding the fact that I love the tune, I thought it was a bad use of a song. If not bad, certainly awkward. The song is about how people take pictures of each other to prove they love each other. Putting pics in a book so that they look back and pretend that they were happy. Classic Ray Davies sarcasm. At best, that's a bizarre theme to have in a commercial for someone trying to sell cameras, no? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bjorn_skurj Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Notwithstanding the fact that I love the tune, I thought it was a bad use of a song. If not bad, certainly awkward. The song is about how people take pictures of each other to prove they love each other. Putting pics in a book so that they look back and pretend that they were happy. Classic Ray Davies sarcasm. At best, that's a bizarre theme to have in a commercial for someone trying to sell cameras, no?I don't think most people think about it that much. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MattZ Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 I don't think most people think about it that much. I wouldn't say I think about it all that much either ( ), just that it falls into the category of commercial where a retailer cherry picked words from a song to sell a product, even though the song not only has nothing to do with it, but could be interpreted as criticising the very product being sold. The irony itself is only something Ray Davies could write a song about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bjorn_skurj Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Kind of like how everybody took "Born in the U.S.A." to be a great patriotic anthem, when it's a song about someone getting totally effed in the a by America. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Notwithstanding the fact that I love the tune, I thought it was a bad use of a song. If not bad, certainly awkward. The song is about how people take pictures of each other to prove they love each other. Putting pics in a book so that they look back and pretend that they were happy. Classic Ray Davies sarcasm. At best, that's a bizarre theme to have in a commercial for someone trying to sell cameras, no? Sure, that's what the song is about. But they didn't use the song, they used a portion of the song that sounded good alongside the images they were using, and it worked (IMO). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
caliber66 Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Kind of like how everybody took "Born in the U.S.A." to be a great patriotic anthem, when it's a song about someone getting totally effed in the a by America.Will somebody please tell bjorn that it's inappropriate to use "effed in the a" in a pejorative sense, as there are those who find such activity pleasureable, and thus its meaning is unclear. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bjorn_skurj Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Will somebody please tell bjorn that it's inappropriate to use "effed in the a" in a pejorative sense, as there are those who find such activity pleasureable, and thus its meaning is unclear.Don't start with me, or I'll start posting some stories that will get this whole board picketed by the Lambdas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.