It's time!

[rareair]

i just found out today that Hillary is running on 35 years of change! wow.

[Edie]

Both of those "Dear red states" "Dear blue states" things that were posted made me sick. Nothing like over generalizations for the sake of an uninformed point.

 

You guys might as well have done this:

 

Liberal: All conservatives hate gays!!11

Conservative: You hate God!!!1

Liberal: A bunch of unfounded bullshit!!

Conservative: EVEN MORE UNFOUNDED BULLSHIT!!!

 

 

That is why I can't stand politics in this country. Nobody ever says anything substantive, and even more importantly, nobody ever listens to the other side. It's just a bunch of white noise coming from both sides.

 

Bobbob, I know what you mean; there is no actual "red and blue" -- states and people are all really shades of purple; some more blue than red and vice versa. However, with the advent of the 24 hour news networks and the vitriolic, contemptuous use of the word "liberal" on so many pundits' lips, it's hard not to fall into the "he said she said" traps, which is why I posted (and loved) the piece that I initially posted.

 

I do take umbrage with your statement "Nobody ever says anything substantive, and even more importantly, nobody ever listens to the other side." I think there is a lot of substance out there, though you do need to find it. And I know that I often listen to "the other side" to get their pulse, and have been swayed from time to time to an angle that I hadn't thought of. I'm sure I am not alone here.

[mountain bed]

And I know that I often listen to "the other side" to get their pulse, and have been swayed from time to time to an angle that I hadn't thought of. I'm sure I am not alone here.

You are definitely not alone Edie. I often listen to viewpoints that I am opposed to under the guise of "know your enemy" but someone that has a really good grasp of language and can deliver opinions intelligently, with a minimum of rhetoric, can give me a fresh new take on a subject.

 

Unfortunately, television and radio are (for the most part) "one way" mediums. We receive, but cannot give when it comes to the free exchange of ideas. And isn't democracy supposed to be about reaching an enlightened view that comes from a two-way exchange of ideas?

[Beltmann]

The trouble is, many people aren't interested in learning more. They are interested not in truth but in justifying what they already believe--which is why so many people find comfort in rhetoric.

[Good Old Neon]

What follows is, I think (and I apologize for its length), a wonderful example of how we should be speaking with each other, blue and red or purple or however you choose to define the growing divide in this country

[Sir Stewart]

Chill the ham?

[embiggen]

damn, that thing takes half a page!

[Good Old Neon]

Ok and so but the following video reminds me of that scene in Rocky IV, the scene in which Rocky, after having had just about enough thanks, throws a wild left or right, catches Drago under the eye, cutting him -- and how, for the first time in the movie, you sort of view Drago as not a machine, but a man - human. And how like, you sort of feel bad for him, Drago, in that very brief moment before Rocky goes all Rocky on his ass, and your recollection that, wait just a second, this is the same mo

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

I thought something similar when I read the NYT account of the incident.

[Good Old Neon]

I thought something similar when I read the NYT account of the incident.

 

Ok and so but I bet you had the scene in which the now retired, punchier, sort of broke, Rocky (which, we now know was not really retired, as in capital

[Tweedling]

And I know that I often listen to "the other side" to get their pulse, and have been swayed from time to time to an angle that I hadn't thought of. I'm sure I am not alone here.

 

"He not busy being born is busy dying."

[blindgonzo]

My friend just got back from Chicago today. While she was there she and her friend took a trip to the Iowa caucus. She ended up being at Obama's victory speech, and said it was pretty electrifying with the energy from the crowd.

 

Tomorrow night I've got a class when the New Hampshire primary will be going on, but I'm making a friend with a laptop keep me up to date with the results!

[uncle wilco]

"the sky is falling!...the sky is falling!"

 

-chicken little

 

hey, politics are here again...yay!?

 

guess what? the longer i've been on VC, the less passionate i've become politically. is it because i'm older and more jaded? or because VC has opened my eyes to other points of view? i think it's both. one thing i will not pursue is belittling other points of view with 19 paragraphs of a letter to an imaginary pastor. i respect your time far too much to waste it like that.

 

in a nutshell, i'm a conservative independent. i would favor thompson on the republican side, but would vote for no one else on the right. unfortunately, thompson is completely invisible this campaign due to the media hating his boring ass and also due to his own penchant for being...invisible.

 

on the other side, i like obama very much. he's about as much a breath of fresh air as you are going to get. i mean, we ARE talking politics here. if fact i like him so much, i may very well toss my conservatism aside and vote for the man. that is, if he gets the nomination. i could then just toe the conservative line with my senate and congressional votes.

 

bottom line. it's not just about ideals, it's about LEADERSHIP. something we've been lacking for at least 8 years now. once we have someone to rally around, we can work out the details on everything else TOGETHER. i will not pretend i know everything, because i don't. i just want something BETTER. i think we can all agree on that without being pig-headed and deaf to an honest dialog. i believe we can do better and to do so will take a UNITED effort on both sides of the aisle.

 

umm...that's all I've got.

 

peace out!

[bjorn_skurj]

bottom line. it's not just about ideals, it's about LEADERSHIP. something we've been lacking for at least 8 years now. once we have someone to rally around, we can work out the details on everything else TOGETHER. i will not pretend i know everything, because i don't. i just want something BETTER. i think we can all agree on that without being pig-headed and deaf to an honest dialog. i believe we can do better and to do so will take a UNITED effort on both sides of the aisle.

Well said.

[Reni]

In all my of thinking back today on my many conversations with Natalie, I thought a lot about our countless political discussions. She and I were kindred when it came to politics and social issues. I was thinking about how sad it makes me that she won't be here for the '08 election. We had both been eagerly anticipating the primary season and discussed it a lot. She loved Obama like I do. It makes me even more sad that she won't be here to see the end of the Bush presidency.

[Good Old Neon]

"the sky is falling!...the sky is falling!"

 

-chicken little

 

hey, politics are here again...yay!?

 

guess what? the longer i've been on VC, the less passionate i've become politically. is it because i'm older and more jaded? or because VC has opened my eyes to other points of view? i think it's both. one thing i will not pursue is belittling other points of view with 19 paragraphs of a letter to an imaginary pastor. i respect your time far too much to waste it like that.

 

It

[MattZ]

If the criteria for being a good president was being a good orator, Obama would have my vote. I am amazed at how many people are running to support him because of the amazing speech he just gave or the hope he gives people. When I dig, I see nothing there. Obama seems to be as much of a product of our addiction to rhetoric as any of the candidates.

 

Just my thoughts - not trying to stir the pot since I know there are a lot of Obama supporters on here. I will vote Dem, and I will vote Obama if he gets the nomination, but I dont get his appeal.

[IRememberDBoon]

If the criteria for being a good president was being a good orator, Obama would have my vote. I am amazed at how many people are running to support him because of the amazing speech he just gave or the hope he gives people. When I dig, I see nothing there. Obama seems to be as much of a product of our addiction to rhetoric as any of the candidates.

 

Just my thoughts - not trying to stir the pot since I know there are a lot of Obama supporters on here. I will vote Dem, and I will vote Obama if he gets the nomination, but I dont get his appeal.

 

 

who appeals to you???

[willywoody]

Just my thoughts - not trying to stir the pot since I know there are a lot of Obama supporters on here. I will vote Dem, and I will vote Obama if he gets the nomination, but I dont get his appeal.

 

 

 

 

http://www.issues2000.org/Barack_Obama.htm

[MattZ]

who appeals to you???

 

In typical politician fashion I am going to dance around your question and respond with the following: I think that experience is key. I appreciate the breath of fresh air that Obama represents, but our country stands on the precipice of domestic, economic and international disaster. Change for change's sake doesn't seem to me to be our best option. There's no right answer here -- I understand why folks see experience as a fault. Washington is broken and someone from Washington can't fix it. But you know what? That line of thinking seems to assume that someone from outside Washington can fix it. And they can't.

[ZenLunatic]

In typical politician fashion I am going to dance around your question and respond with the following: I think that experience is key. I appreciate the breath of fresh air that Obama represents, but our country stands on the precipice of domestic, economic and international disaster. Change for change's sake doesn't seem to me to be our best option. There's no right answer here -- I understand why folks see experience as a fault. Washington is broken and someone from Washington can't fix it. But you know what? That line of thinking seems to assume that someone from outside Washington can fix it. And they can't.

 

That means you like Hillary.

[IRememberDBoon]

In typical politician fashion I am going to dance around your question and respond with the following: I think that experience is key. I appreciate the breath of fresh air that Obama represents, but our country stands on the precipice of domestic, economic and international disaster. Change for change's sake doesn't seem to me to be our best option. There's no right answer here -- I understand why folks see experience as a fault. Washington is broken and someone from Washington can't fix it. But you know what? That line of thinking seems to assume that someone from outside Washington can fix it. And they can't.

 

 

good lord. stay in NYC and let us run the country down here.

[MattZ]

That means you like Hillary.

 

 

good lord. stay in NYC and let us run the country down here.

 

[Good Old Neon]

In typical politician fashion I am going to dance around your question and respond with the following: I think that experience is key. I appreciate the breath of fresh air that Obama represents, but our country stands on the precipice of domestic, economic and international disaster. Change for change's sake doesn't seem to me to be our best option. There's no right answer here -- I understand why folks see experience as a fault. Washington is broken and someone from Washington can't fix it. But you know what? That line of thinking seems to assume that someone from outside Washington can fix it. And they can't.

 

Well said, Matt.

 

Things are, I think, broken to the point at which it will take a tremendous amount of courage, sacrifice, on a scale both large and small, and tremendous political will, from politicians, big business and our fellow citizens before any sort of meaningful, honest change comes about.

 

How we go about doing that, well, that is the difficult part. I don

[IRememberDBoon]

The only reason things are broken at this point is THE REPUBLICAN PARTY. Me thinks things were pretty damn good back in 99. I'll take the country in that state any time. Thanks for playing.