It's time!

[cryptique]

get over myself?? thats rich coming from you. go vote for ron paul and stick yer head further in the sand.

 

You obviously haven't been paying the slightest attention to anything I've posted.

[IRememberDBoon]

I cant believe how unbelievably dumb and retarted that was. If that was serious on your part, you have proven yourself as what you are.

 

Anyways, he is part of your party system. Thats your man.

 

 

I thought he was a Republican!

 

 

You obviously haven't been paying the slightest attention to anything I've posted.

 

 

you are correct sir.

[gogo]

Let's all take a step back and a deep breath, OK? Kate started this thread with the intention of discussing the primary results, making predictions, etc. We can all champion whichever candidates we like, but there's no need to personally attack people for their political choices. Keep it civil, please.

[PopTodd]

Watching the Dems. debate over the weekend, I was surprised at how impressed I was with Bill Richardson.

 

I really like Hillary, but think that the GOP hates her so much that she would never be able to build any sort of bi-partisan support for... anything, really. No matter how good the idea, and how great the plan.

 

I like Obama. A lot. But I think that he'll need some good folks in the Oval Office with him, at least for the first little while, until he gets his feet wet and gets rolling. He can be a great president. Some day. There's just a BIG mess to clean up. And I just hope that he's ready for it.

 

Edwards has a great message, but has struck me as something of a slimy hypocrite. However sincere he may actually be. Ain't gonna work for me.

 

Richardson just came of as a steady ship in the middle of a storm. Not terribly exciting, but smart, and ready to lead. Has some great ideas and great experience.

 

All in all, I think that it will be Obama (not a bad choice, by any means), and Richardson will hopefully be in the Oval Office, either as VP, or in a cabinet post. (I think that his foreign policy experience would make him an excellent Sec. of State.)

 

EDIT: And, for the record, there are a couple of GOP candidates that are okay, too. Anything is better than this.

[Good Old Neon]

i think that a monolgue that long is completely unnecessary. it presents only one side and only makes assumptions about the other. however a bright mind this person is, he doesn't have any idea how or what i think being a christian conservative. i'll bet he likes the sound of his own voice too. but of course, not knowing the man, i'm only making an assumption with that statement.

 

biologists don't know nothing...about my soul. they don't know.

 

in my view, this is not just a "waystation" on the way to heaven and i take offense to that remark by this "enlightened" one. i have children and they will eventually have children and so on. i believe that we should care about the world we live in. believing in an afterlife does not mean one does not care about the here and now. I believe this is God's creation and we should look after it. i don't know of any Christian that i've known who believes otherwise. maybe this scientist should actually interact with a real pastor instead of firing off preconcieved missives to imaginary ones. he might find we already have more in common than he thinks we do.

 

Interesting, you might think otherwise if you were familiar with his strict religious upbringing.

 

In fact, it could be argued that biologists, of all people, do have a greater understanding of the inner workings of the mind, and in fact do. Which, is why most biologists tend to be atheists or agnostics. Which that said, Wilson described himself as an agnostic, not an atheist, meaning, he is open to other possibilities, but, from a scientific standpoint, sees little to no evidence to suggest there is an afterlife

[uncle wilco]

I really like Hillary, but think that the GOP hates her so much that she would never be able to build any sort of bi-partisan support for... anything, really. No matter how good the idea, and how great the plan.

 

according to polls that i've heard, 50% of hillary's OWN party would never vote for her. of course, the GOP feels the same way. of all the democrats, Obama has the best chance to work with the other side of the aisle in my opinion.

[Beltmann]

Right now Obama's speeches are indeed rousing, and, indeed, lacking in policy specifics. However, last night I spent several hours reading his website, particulary his specific proposals and justifications. There's more substance there than he's usually given credit for.

[Good Old Neon]

Who is Barack Obama?

 

Very interesting and something that should be considered in your choice.

 

 

If you do not ever forward anything else, please forward this to all

your contacts...this is very scary to think of what lies ahead of us

here in our own United States...better heed this and pray about it and

share it.

 

We checked this out on "snopes.com". It is factual. Check for yourself.

 

Who is Barack Obama?

 

Probable U. S. presidential candidate, Barack Hussein Obama was born in

Honolulu, Hawaii, to Barack Hussein Obama, Sr., a black MUSLIM from

Nyangoma-Kogel, Kenya and Ann Dunham, a white ATHIEST from Wichita,

Kansas.

Obama's parents met at the University of Hawaii. When Obama was two

years old, his parents divorced. His father returned to Kenya. His

mother then married Lolo Soetoro, a RADICAL Muslim from Indonesia. When

Obama was 6 years old, the family relocate to

Indonesia. Obama attended a MUSLIM school in Jakarta. He also spent

two years in a Catholic school.

 

Obama takes great care to conceal the fact that he is a Muslim. He is

quick to point out that, "He was once a Muslim, but that he also

attended Catholic school."

 

Obama's political handlers are attempting to make it appear that he is

not a radical.

 

Obama's introduction to Islam came via his father, and that this

influence was temporary at best. In reality, the senior Obama returned

to Kenya soon after the divorce, and never again had any direct

influence over his son's education.

 

Lolo Soetoro, the second husband of Obama's mother, Ann Dunham,

introduced his stepson to Islam. Obama was enrolled in a Wahabi school

in Jakarta.

 

Wahabism is the RADICAL teaching that is followed by the Muslim

terrorists who are now waging Jihad against the western world. Since it

is politically expedient to be a CHRIST IAN when seeking major public

office in the United States, Barack Hussein Obama has joined the United

Church of Christ in an attempt to

downplay his Muslim background. ALSO, keep in mind that when he was

sworn into office he DID NOT use the Holy Bible, but instead the Koran.

 

Barack Hussein Obama will NOT recite the Pledge of Allegiance nor will

he show any reverence for our flag. While others place their hands over

their hearts, Obama turns his back to the flag and slouches.

 

Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential

candidacy.

 

The Muslims have said they plan on destroying the US from the inside

out, what better way to start than at the highest level - through the

President of the United States, one of their own!!!!

 

Please forward to everyone you know. Would you want this man leading our

country?...... NOT ME!!!

 

 

 

 

it gives me a bit better grasp than some jagoff from Ann Arbor

 

Please tell me that post was intended as a joke

[Beltmann]

I received a version of that in spring--when it was thoroughly debunked by journalists. I guess it only takes a year for the lies to resume with a shiny new surface.

[gogo]

I received a version of that in spring--when it was thoroughly debunked by journalists. I guess it only takes a year for the lies to resume with a shiny new surface.

I especially like

 

We checked this out on "snopes.com". It is factual. Check for yourself.

 

When in fact, this is what snopes.com has to say.

[mountain bed]

Today's the big day. This is so exciting!

 

I'm not a fan, but McCain would seem to be the only guy with any chance of beating the Dem nominee.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

I'm sure DBoon intended it as a joke. I think he's an Obama supporter.

[MattZ]

Most Obama supporters will admit (and I think Obama himself will admit) that his policies and positions are not all that different than Hillary's. No one is out there seriously suggesting that Obama's health care plan is that different than Hillary's.

 

So, maybe I am generalizing here, but that seems to mean that most people are leaning to Obama because he is new, because he is fresh, and because he is a wonderful orator that makes people feel good. That is not something to be ignored in politics. But for me, at this point in our nation's history, I feel more comfortable with someone that knows foreign leaders personally, has more experience in fighting against and working with Republicans, and at the end of the day has a network (or machine, if you prefer) that she can fall back on for counsel, advice, etc. And I want Bill in the Middle East on January 21.

 

Not presenting my opinions as fact because they obviously aren't. I am just surprised at all the people that write off Hillary because she is cold or because she doesnt make people feel good when she speaks. Or because she is "experienced" and thus tainted. Oh well.

[Good Old Neon]

I received a version of that in spring--when it was thoroughly debunked by journalists. I guess it only takes a year for the lies to resume with a shiny new surface.

 

What

[uncle wilco]

Interesting, you might think otherwise if you were familiar with his strict religious upbringing.

 

it doesn't matter where you start, it's where you are now that matters.

 

In fact, it could be argued that biologists, of all people, do have a greater understanding of the inner workings of the mind, and in fact do. Which, is why most biologists tend to be atheists or agnostics. Which that said, Wilson described himself as an agnostic, not an atheist, meaning, he is open to other possibilities, but, from a scientific standpoint, sees little to no evidence to suggest there is an afterlife

[yermom]

And I want Bill in the Middle East on January 21.

You don't have to be boinking him to put him to use as an ambassador, right?

[Reni]

What’s worse, several of my co-workers will not be voting for Obama in today’s primary, not because they disagree with him on political grounds, but a direct result of that very same email.

 

Sad, sad, sad.

 

Of course, some people are still laboring under the delusion that Bill Gates will be dropping them a check in the mail, a thank you of sorts for forwarding on that particular piece of junk mail….

 

my uncle, who has a habit of sending bigoted and ignorant emails (ya know, the ones that say stuff like, "we are being invaded by Mexicans!") sent me this same Obama email.....I kind of flew through this thread (so, I don't know if this was posted) but Graham found this link and I sent it back to my uncle.

[Beltmann]

Anybody else see Andrew Sullivan on Colbert last night--he was rhapsodic about Obama.

 

I agree with everything you said, Matt. Hillary's smarts and experience should definitely be assets, not liabilities.

[Good Old Neon]

Most Obama supporters will admit (and I think Obama himself will admit) that his policies and positions are not all that different than Hillary's. No one is out there seriously suggesting that Obama's health care plan is that different than Hillary's.

 

So, maybe I am generalizing here, but that seems to mean that most people are leaning to Obama because he is new, because he is fresh, and because he is a wonderful orator that makes people feel good. That is not something to be ignored in politics. But for me, at this point in our nation's history, I feel more comfortable with someone that knows foreign leaders personally, has more experience in fighting against and working with Republicans, and at the end of the day has a network (or machine, if you prefer) that she can fall back on for counsel, advice, etc. And I want Bill in the Middle East on January 21.

 

Not presenting my opinions as fact because they obviously aren't. I am just surprised at all the people that write off Hillary because she is cold or because she doesnt make people feel good when she speaks. Or because she is "experienced" and thus tainted. Oh well.

 

Given what you've stated here, I think Biden was your man, well, if we are to pick from the current crop of democrats, not counting their spouses.

 

I'm amazed he was never taken seriously as a candidate given his vast experience. But, like you said, folks are looking for change first, and experience second or third or....

[ZenLunatic]

Not presenting my opinions as fact because they obviously aren't. I am just surprised at all the people that write off Hillary because she is cold or because she doesnt make people feel good when she speaks. Or because she is "experienced" and thus tainted. Oh well.

 

Alot has to do with feelings you get from a canidate. You cant deny what your body tells you. I'm sure Hillary will do an OK job, but I see big things happening with Obama. He brings a higher level of thinking IMO. I think you also have to look at the inexperience of Obama as being something good too.

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

Alot has to do with feelings you get from a canidate. You cant deny what your body tells you. I'm sure Hillary will do an OK job, but I see big things happening with Obama. He brings a higher level of thinking IMO. I think you also have to look at the inexperience of Obama as being something good too.

 

 

"Where would we be without wishful thinking?"

 

 

Inexperinece in the most important job/position in the world being good? Are you SERIOUS? Obama had a thin resume when he got elected to the Senate and now he wants to parlay his rock star status with the intelligentsia into running what is left of the most powerful country in the world?

 

Yeah...

 

What we need after 8 years of the great decider is a firm hand at the till, not someone that has to learn where the till is.

 

I'm not sure if there is a candidate who will be a successful president.

 

Last days of the Modern Roman Empire? You tell me.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

Andrew Sullivan made a pretty good case for Obama here:

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200712/obama

 

Many points I disagree with, but I think he hits the nail on the head here:

 

What does he offer? First and foremost: his face. Think of it as the most effective potential re-branding of the United States since Reagan. Such a re-branding is not trivial

[Good Old Neon]

What disturbs me, is how the frontrunners within the democrat pool of candidates were pretty much chosen, by the media, a good year or so ago, before we, the voters, had any say in the matter.

 

The media had pretty much whittled it down to a race between Obama and Hillary, at the expense of the other candidates, most of whom, tend to have some good ideas. And, a result, much of the actual choosing, was, I think, already chosen for us. Because lets face it, the American public can be pretty damn complacent, sort of go with the flow-ish and easily influenced and/or swayed in situations such as this

[MattZ]

Alot has to do with feelings you get from a canidate. You cant deny what your body tells you. I'm sure Hillary will do an OK job, but I see big things happening with Obama. He brings a higher level of thinking IMO. I think you also have to look at the inexperience of Obama as being something good too.

 

Yeah but the thing that baffles me is that feelings don't negotiate peace in the middle east. Connections, relationships, respect, hard work, experience do. What if we elect Obama because he makes us feel good and it turns out it takes him 2 years to get his bearings? Or it turns out that speeches notwithstanding he's not very good at foreign policy?

 

I am not saying these are inevitables. He could be great. He could hit the ground running and be the best president any of could hope for. But without any existing evidence to back it up, why are so many people so willing to throw the dice, at such a precarious time in our nation's history? Like I said, let's assume for the moment that on an issues-based level, that there's not that big of a difference between Hillary and Obama.

 

Not looking to spur on an 8 page debate on this -- just find the whole thing interesting.

[Good Old Neon]

Yeah but the thing that baffles me is that feelings don't negotiate peace in the middle east. Connections, relationships, respect, hard work, experience do. What if we elect Obama because he makes us feel good and it turns out it takes him 2 years to get his bearings? Or it turns out that speeches notwithstanding he's not very good at foreign policy?

 

I am not saying these are inevitables. He could be great. He could hit the ground running and be the best president any of could hope for. But without any existing evidence to back it up, why are so many people so willing to throw the dice, at such a precarious time in our nation's history? Like I said, let's assume for the moment that on an issues-based level, that there's not that big of a difference between Hillary and Obama.

 

Not looking to spur on an 8 page debate on this -- just find the whole thing interesting.

 

I