School induced Insomnia

[kimcatch22]

Bravo to everything you said, especially this:

Yes, some (or many) students are lazy, apathetic, and unmotivated. You know what? They should fail and make way for motivated students who don't have the opportunity. What are the excuses for lame professors? Do we get our money back when our teachers SUCK? It works both ways. How many professors are truly inspired by and motivated for the good of the students?

and this:

The purpose of education should not just be technique or method (or securing a vocation) but also the development of critical thinking tools.

and the whole bit about mediocrity. I was about to quote that too, but then realized I was paraphrasing your entire post.

[Good Old Neon]

"You wasted $150,000 on an education you coulda got for $1.50 in late fees at the public library." - my good friend, Will Hunting

[Good Old Neon]

Truth be told, I really wanted to go to Apex Tech to learn how to fix things, but my parents made me go to a real college. So in revenge, I got a shitty job in a dying field and will eventually hit them up for money.

 

[cryptique]

ponch certainly has a fair point about professors/instructors. I went to a very exclusive school that was in a position to hire the best of the best (deepseacatfish is there now), but there were a handful of instructors there who weren't worthy of their positions. Even one or two of the good, seasoned professors I had lacked a fundamental understanding of different styles of learning among students, and their methods for assessing their students' progress (and assigning grades) were arbitrary and unfair.

 

But, that's par for the course. Academia is a pretty corrupt atmosphere in its own way. At the large university level, of course, many profs rarely set foot in the classroom ... and those who do might not be very good at teaching, because the emphasis in faculty hiring at that level is more about publications and research (contributing to the status of the university) than about the ability to teach (which I could have sworn was the purpose of the university in the first place).

[fickerson]

Yea..in 30 years none of this will matter....enjoy college while you are there....

 

LouieB

 

i adopted that attitude, and i ended up flunking out. i eventually graduated, but it took me like 4028 years.

[captain obvious]

i adopted that attitude, and i ended up flunking out. i eventually graduated, but it took me like 4028 years.

It could not possibly have taken you that long to complete your education.

[fickerson]

It could not possibly have taken you that long to complete your education.

 

i said like!

[bjorn_skurj]

It could not possibly have taken you that long to complete your education.

I just thought she went to the University of Amon-Ra.

[jenbobblehead]

you know what i hate? I hated that i dropped out of undergrad and went back 10 years later, and then didn't go right to grad school after, and now at 42 i'll be graduating with a masters, trying to work in a field that i've already been working in for 8 years, for probably less money than i had before i went to school with almost 30K in student loans. Wtf was i thinking?

 

my point is--don't wait. It sucks to be older and trying to get a job while competing with people almost half my age with the same degree and none of the gray.

 

[Tweedling]

I went to school for a while but then I realized making money is better than owing money.

 

So I quit and got a job.

[Katie3]

Hi.

I'm a grade 12 student waiting to hear from universities. I have cried countless amounts of times stressing over my marks. After receiving my semester one marks today I have learned there is an extremely low chance of me being accepted anywhere. I have cried four times today about this. I loathe you.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Hi.

I'm a grade 12 student waiting to hear from universities. I have cried countless amounts of times stressing over my marks. After receiving my semester one marks today I have learned there is an extremely low chance of me being accepted anywhere. I have cried four times today about this. I loathe you.

 

You will, don't worry. May not happen immediately or where you think it ought to happen, but you'll soon find out that doesn't matter.

 

* * *

 

And now, to the original poster:

 

I'm less than a year out of school with an excellent job I was very lucky to land. My work is challenging, fun, and I can say decisively that nothing you posted will matter when you're done with schooland every single assignment will matter.

 

First, screw 'five paragraphs.' All paragraphs should be one thought ONLY, no more, and around 100 words. Write until you're done - no sooner, no later.

 

Next, while all essays seem the same (make an argument, lose sleep, get a grade, etc.), they are all unique in their objectives, though it doesn't necessarily seem that way at the time.

 

Professor who is vague, but clearly wants something specific? This didn't sneak up on you. You probably knew that the moment you walked in the class. Here you master the art of listening to someone else's point of view, and framing an argument in their schema. Think that's bullshitting? That's a persuasive essay. Learning how to write an argument within someone else's way of thinking, explaining so they understand you but also getting them to agree with you, is the art of persuasion. It's not lying unless *you're* lying. You will need to know how to do this after college. I have to interact with a branch of the government that likes arguments presented very specifically; I use this skill daily.

 

The next topic you encounter in essays is explaining something to an audience that knows nothing of what you're discussing - the research paper. You need to concisely introduce a topic that is foreign to the reader, with enough background that they get it but not so much that it detracts from the point, and then explaining why your research is important. You will need to know how to do this after college, and not just with research. I spend most of my day explaining my industry to people who have no need to understand anything outside of what directly affects them. I use this skill daily.

 

The assignment you think is stupid. Do I even need to explain this one? You get out of your education what you put into it. If you do poorly in school, it only affects you. After school, you'll find that poor decisions at work/home/wherever affect people besides you. Learn how to do it right while it's still just you. That one I didn't pick up on in school, and the terror of affecting someone else's life because I was lazy only needed to happen once for me.

 

Every aspect of your higher education is a learning experience: doing things you don't want to do, doing things you don't know how to do but should, time management (the class you might have slept through), learning how to write the papers other people want you to write - the degree you receive tells people you know how to do all of that. Your degree does *not* tell people you're really good at history/english/math/whatever.

 

Also, start saving for heating bills now. They're a BITCH.

[bjorn_skurj]

Hi.

I'm a grade 12 student waiting to hear from universities. I have cried countless amounts of times stressing over my marks. After receiving my semester one marks today I have learned there is an extremely low chance of me being accepted anywhere. I have cried four times today about this. I loathe you.

Vibes, Ms. 333. Do they not have community colleges in Canada? They are a good place for people to get their footing academically and decide what they want to study.

[kimcatch22]

Seconded on the vibes to katie333.

Bjorn's right about community college. And in addition to things like English, math, and biology, those institutions often have programs that are less academically-oriented (for lack of better phrasing, forgive me, I'm on cold meds,) and more real-world applicable -- for example, culinary arts. You never know what you may fall in love with.

Also, before you consider all hope lost on your choice universities, remember that colleges look at the whole package. That's why you did that whole application with all of the different parts, after all. Depending on the size and level of competition of the places you've applied to, any number of things could happen: a follow-up interview with a chance to explain differences in your recent grades versus the rest of your application, waitlisting, or acceptance into learning assistance programs that match you with a mentor and help you develop study skills during your first year as a student, to name just a few. Don't write yourself off. You obviously have the passion and the dedication; you'll find a way to make things work.

[Mr. Kinsley]

Vibes, Ms. 333. Do they not have community colleges in Canada? They are a good place for people to get their footing academically and decide what they want to study.

All that and they're really friggin' cheap! And when you transfer to the university of your choice, it's not like your diploma will have an asterik on it. Still works.

 

 

Also, my brief $.02 on the original post in this thread - if you're writing two papers at whatever god-awful time of night you're doing that at, don't waste your time posting on a rock band fan site. Crank it out and go to bed!

[Griddles]

I do no t even know where to start because I have been sleeping and studying all day so have not had a chance to respond.

 

ponch1028 said a whole bunch of things that I totally agree with.

 

 

Hi.

I'm a grade 12 student waiting to hear from universities. I have cried countless amounts of times stressing over my marks. After receiving my semester one marks today I have learned there is an extremely low chance of me being accepted anywhere. I have cried four times today about this. I loathe you.

 

Well that sucks, like really. It sucks that people who want to go to school and do their very best cannot get in while there are people who are dumber than a container of shoe polish who get in just because their parents can pay for it. I really hope you get into school somewhere.

 

And now, to the original poster:

 

 

Every aspect of your higher education is a learning experience: doing things you don't want to do, doing things you don't know how to do but should, time management (the class you might have slept through), learning how to write the papers other people want you to write the degree you receive tells people you know how to do all of that.[/b] Your degree does *not* tell people you're really good at history/english/math/whatever.

 

Also, start saving for heating bills now. They're a BITCH.

 

But your degree should let people know that you are really good at something. If a degree is just to prove that you can finish assignments and do stuff you do not want to do, why are there different degrees?

 

Heating bills are a bitch now!

 

There is a whole lot more to say, but it is hard to address each aspect so I will stop now.

[andshewas]

Due tomorrow is an essay that I'm supposed to be writing for my Spanish class, but I am easily distracted and can't bring myself to do it. I'm soon to face doom. = [

 

 

I'm a first-semester sophomore [just came started again after a semester break], and I can't tell you how incredibly difficult it is for me to see myself getting the meteorology degree I've set out for.

 

I think it would've been different if I had been accepted at the first school I applied at. I know that I would have been challenged, that I would have changed; having to settle for a lesser institution hasn't done much for my motivation or work ethic. That's why I continue to stay up into the wee hours of the morning to write papers at the last minute--just like I did in high school. It's so easy to skate by with such little effort, especially when I still get As for mediocre work. Not having to spend time studying, or having to dedicate time to finding a good study system really worries me, because I don't know if there's another way to develop those skills--aside from hunkering down and just doing it.

 

I can't understand how some kids fail the same classes twice or three times in a row, when little is expected of their work [from the Professors and TAs]. I got a B+ in a class last year just for going to class 90% of the time, finishing most of the homework, and writing 9 pages of a 15 page paper. The class was instructed by the chairman of the economics department. You would think that he, of all people--editor of renowned economic journal [or so he said], researcher, intuitive analyst--would expect more effort and better work. [i think universities should offer classes on reverse logic, just so that the students that pay so much for their poor education can understand why such squalor runs rampant on campus.]

That professor isn't unlike the others I've had so far...however, the atmosci professor that I had my first semester seemed to have his head on straight. He told us a few times that he has a black belt in karate, and once claimed that he could "still kick this kid's ass" in his slightly old age.

[His hair looked like a cloud on his head. Definitely fit for a career in weather.]

 

That said, miss Katie, I'm sure you'd be welcome at my school. You'd have to move to Milwaukee [not cool like Canada], but they let almost everyone in. I'm sure they'd accept a Canadian for diversity purposes...

[giraffo]

if you went to where I go, you do that on average, and pull all nighters in spring semesters once a week. I had 10 pages of comics due today, 5 of which I had less than 5 days to do. I stayed up til 7 am and woke up at 12:30 a half hour late for class. frequently you have 8-10 hours of homework for each class. I think USA today or something remarked my school as having the most work for an undergraduate...

[caliber66]

Also, my brief $.02 on the original post in this thread - if you're writing two papers at whatever god-awful time of night you're doing that at, don't waste your time posting on a rock band fan site. Crank one out and go to bed!

Sometimes that works for clearing the head.

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

Well. It is not that I hate school (keep in mind it was four in the morning when this topic was started). I do feel privileged to be getting a higher education. I understand, as my professors continually tell us, that in completing a college degree one becomes part of the top 1% of people in the entire world. What that top 1% is, or how it is researched I do not know.

 

While I do not hate school I really dislike many things about it. Such as a lack of consistency in what is expected. For example in elementary school I all learned how to both print and write in cursive. In middle school all the teachers had us write in cursive, because, "that is what teachers at the high school will want." when I got to high school no teacher asked for cursive, they just wanted it to be legible. In high school I was taught the five paragraph essay because, "that is what college professors will want." For the last two years at college, professors have been beating the five paragraph essay out of myself and my companions. As for cursive writing, I barely turn in any hand written work, and when I do it is mostly just checked for completion. The only time I use cursive is to sign my name and to amuse my self during boring lectures.

 

It is things like this that make me question the true value of a higher education. Is it just the slip of paper that says you showed up every day for 4 years, or is there real knowledge to be gained? I believe at this point many classes are just happy to have people show up, and thus pass them.

 

I could add more but it is time to finally sleep.

 

 

Ahhh... your problems will be solved with a year or two with private sector employment.

 

The public sector would drive you fucking mad

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

Yeah, I think we could all stand to lighten up a bit on Ed.

 

[fatheadfred]

Hopefully you'll run into a couple instructors that enable you to see why being able to think is important. As I approach my mid-30's I am already thinking, "this country is going to hell". Is it because the college kids are oblivious to how to read a book instead of 10 second online jabs? Is it because a rare few have an idea of the primary candidates? Is it because few can formulate their own thought?

 

Maybe it is psychological development continues to be delayed. Being 24 y.o. now is like being 18-19 in the 60's? Is this why we have unrealistic expectations of 'these damn kids nowadays'?

 

I totally agree that some teachers suck. But hey, can you really expect everyone of them to be good? Is every band as good as Wilco? Hell no. None of them are.

[Mrs. Peel]

This is a little off topic, but reading all these comments about choice of schools, lousy professors, and other alternatives has prompted me to share my story.

 

I had excellent grades in high school, and when it came time for college I applied to 5 schools and was accepted to all of them. The fifth school was my safety. I wasn't particularly fond of it when I visited, but my parents urged me to go ahead and submit the application anyway. Well, when I got my acceptance letters, the safety school offered me a scholarship equal to around 3/4 of my tuition. My parents were visibly relieved to see this, and since they were paying I regrettably chose that school to ease the financial burden. I spent 1 1/2 years there, in which time I experienced numerous professors dropping the ball and wasting my time. One notable example was my Ethics teacher who upon hearing it was Rush Week canceled our scheduled exam because "no one will show up anyway". But my favorite had to be the Art History teacher (one of the majors I was considering) who actually made up explanations for paintings when he didn't know the stories behind them. Claude Monet has a series of paintings of Poplar trees. My professor has apparently misread the word Poplar through his whole career, because he went into a long speech about how Monet painted this series because it was the most popular tree of his time. And I won't even go into his version of Rubens' "The Judgment Of Paris".

 

I left that school and took a year off where I worked in a factory on a manufacturing line. Even though I had worked there on my summer breaks, the idea that this could be the rest of my life was truly eye-opening.

 

I went to school number 2, a state university with a stellar reputation, for another year, but I still just did not get the sense that my particular professors were very driven for the most part, including the sculpture teacher who was on smoke breaks more frequently than she was in the classroom, and I was at a point where I didn't find anything rewarding enough to commit to a major. I then decided to attend school number 3, also a state school but viewed as more of a community school than an institution. I remember my father was none too thrilled with this decision, as it was his dream that I would some day be an international lawyer, and here I was, going to a sub-par college. It was there that I had first rate professors, including a photography teacher who was SO passionate about his field that I fell in love with it myself. I graduated with an BFA in Photography and now work in the field.

 

It took me 5 1/2 years to find my perfect fit and finish school. I found my niche at the least prestigious of the 3 schools I attended. I maintained excellent grades throughout my college career and graduated Magna Cum Laude in the field that was right for me. If I hadn't trusted my gut and changed gears when I did, I'm not sure where I'd be today.

 

I guess what I'm getting at is if you feel like you aren't getting the education you were expecting, go somewhere else before you get completely embedded, because every school is going to offer a completely different experience with completely different results. You may find that when taught by a different person, the same subjects you're loathing right now could turn out to be your career path later.

[a.miller]

Mrs. Peel -- very, very well said. My educational history is fairly similar to yours. You echo my thoughts.

[andshewas]

Peel,

 

You're completely right. I need a sense of urgency about my education, and your suggestion to change schools may be what I need.

Thanks for making me think.