Congrats to President-Elect OBAMA

[bleedorange]

The middle and lower classes are sacrificing their children in Iraq. As has always been the case throughout this nations history

[Sir Stewart]

Again, no one is arguing your second point. People understand the necessity for taxes within any government.

 

This assumption is definitely debatable.

[MattZ]

This assumption is definitely debatable.

 

Come on, BT/SirS. No one (not even JUDE) is arguing that they should have to pay zero in taxes. Just that they don't think they should have to pay more (or as much).

[solace]

Solace wrote:

Oh, so you need a college diploma to prove your smart enough to vote? Only those with college diplomas know what's going on in America?

 

 

The eliticism on this board makes me puke.

 

nobody's saying that... you're the one claiming that Democrats were stupid with that comic, i just posted a few facts, that many would take to mean the opposite of that, but make of them what you will.

 

and nobody's saying that about college graduates, but the fact that the right has made being well educated into somehow a NEGATIVE thing over the last decade is disgusting and sad.

 

and yeah, as someone pointed out, it's elitism... but nevermind me, i'm not a college graduate either.

[Mrs. Peel]

Andrew Sullivan wrote a fantastic essay about the state of the country since 9/11 and why he is so confident in Obama, even though he doesn't agree with him on every issue.

I don't want to copy it here because it is very long. It's well worth the time though.

[Sir Stewart]

Come on, BT/SirS. No one (not even JUDE) is arguing that they should have to pay zero in taxes. Just that they don't think they should have to pay more (or as much).

OK.

[LouieB]

Are there really people on this board making over $250,000 a year? Really?? If so you are some lucky motherfuckers...I have been working my entire life and I don't make anywhere near that.....

 

LouieB

[John Smith]

People understand the necessity for taxes within any government.

 

But I fail to see how increasing tax rates on those who are wealthy (an imaginary phrase that keeps getting a lower and lower threshold), will solve all of our problems. In fact, I think filling the government's coffers and writing checks to people will only exacerbate them.

 

There are plenty of other avenues to take to get this country back on track. Enlisting more government help and interference seems to be ignoring one of the main causes of the problems in the first place. (Queue John Smith's inevitable response about deregulation being the sole cause to the economic struggles.)

 

Deregulation? let me tell ya...

 

I'm sorry, but people where I live totally do not get the need for taxes even as our roads ride like the warning strips on highways. Not where I live. They think it is just shitty government that you need a four wheel drive to get down a main highway. They certainly don't want to actually pay for those roads to be fixed and especially not the farmers who drive their multi-ton vehicles on roads not rated for them. Nope the association is not made here.

 

Were taxes too high during the Clinton years? We seemd to boom throughout the 1990's. Were they too high duriing the Reagan years? We seemed to do OK then. Were they too high during the magical 1950's? Well the 1950's are not a fair compairison since they were paying off the WWII debt.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

Again, no one is arguing your second point. People understand the necessity for taxes within any government.

 

But I fail to see how increasing tax rates on those who are wealthy (an imaginary phrase that keeps getting a lower and lower threshold), will solve all of our problems. In fact, I think filling the government's coffers and writing checks to people will only exacerbate them.

 

There are plenty of other avenues to take to get this country back on track. Enlisting more government help and interference seems to be ignoring one of the main causes of the problems in the first place. (Queue John Smith's inevitable response about deregulation being the sole cause to the economic struggles.)

"The wealthy" is an imaginary phrase?

[JUDE]

How about completely subjective?

[EL the Famous]

Are there really people on this board making over $250,000 a year? Really?? If so you are some lucky motherfuckers...I have been working my entire life and I don't make anywhere near that.....

 

therein lies another misnomer, that just because one would benefit personally from said cut...that they still agree w/ a cut and/or revision of the brackets in and of itself.

 

jude, not an attack, but i'm curious on how you vote w/ school referendums come up on a ballot? w/ a father and a wife who are both educators, i've been personally involved in/campaigned for a bunch and the public reaction to those are just as fascinating to me as presidential elections.

[Spawn's dad]

When spawn was a baby I wiped his bottom with 100s softened by cheap immigrant labor.

[explodo]

I have to believe that the whole "taxes are bad" thing comes from the fact that the American people have never a tax system that really works for them. It is easy to hate on taxes when they take away all of your money and you still have to drive down shitty roads to get your kids to shitty schools or whatever else. We shoot shuttles into space but don't give kids health care.

[JUDE]

therein lies another misnomer, that just because one would benefit personally from said cut...that they still agree w/ a cut and/or revision of the brackets in and of itself.

 

jude, not an attack, but i'm curious on how you vote w/ school referendums come up on a ballot? w/ a father and a wife who are both educators, i've been personally involved in/campaigned for a bunch and the public reaction to those are just as fascinating to me as presidential elections.

 

It really depends. I've recently vote no because we passed one 6 years ago for a much needed new high school and middle school. After the abuses and misspending on those two facilities, i.e. 3000 square foot vaulted ceiling granite atriums, radiused walls in every corridor, and a new "administrative building" that would make some architectural digest contributors green with envy, I need to see more accountability before I can vote yes in good conscience again.

 

I don't have a problem funding necessities but I've seen to many examples of how easy it is to spend other people

[LouieB]

I have to believe that the whole "taxes are bad" thing comes from the fact that the American people have never a tax system that really works for them. It is easy to hate on taxes when they take away all of your money and you still have to drive down shitty roads to get your kids to shitty schools or whatever else. We shoot shuttles into space but don't give kids health care.

here here....we all want want want what we want...but we don't want to have to pay for it.....and we don't want anyone else to have it either....

 

LouieB

[EL the Famous]

I don't have a problem funding necessities but I've seen to many examples of how easy it is to spend other people

[MattZ]

We shoot shuttles into space but don't give kids health care.

 

Reminds me of that great David Berman poem, Self Portrait at 28:

 

We will travel to Mars

even as folks on Earth

are still ripping open potato chip

bags with their teeth.

[Analogman]

Reminds me of that great David Berman poem, Self Portrait at 28:

 

We will travel to Mars

even as folks on Earth

are still ripping open potato chip

bags with their teeth.

 

 

Man thinks 'cause he rules the earth he can do with it as he please

And if things don't change soon, he will

Oh, man has invented his doom

First step was touching the moon.

[Mrs. Peel]

If I could solve the world's problems I'd probably start with hers and mine

But they can put a man on the moon

And I'm stuck down here just scraping by

[JUDE]

I hear you, but how does the administration asking for it not have accountability? I really do think that is a fair approach, it's the (hate to say it) grumpy retiree voter block that will op-ed the things to shreads while programs are getting cut. i don't have kids in school anymore, so why should i vote in favor of it.

 

 

OK so say you are the school board/administration and you ask for $10 million for new facilities and to hire more teachers for the growing student population. In and of itself quite a respectable request. The problem arises when once the voter

[EL the Famous]

right on. i do believe if you are going to try and pass one, you better damn well make sure you are handling the funds appropriately...it can fuck you for the next request if you don't.

[quarter23cd]

Well, this just knocked me off my seat:

 

from Quinnipiac:

Among early voters in Ohio, Obama leads 64 - 26 percent.

 

I'm waiting for the follow-up headline announcing: GOP files suit to classify early votes as "practice votes" and purge them from totals.

 

 

I've said all through this thing that my gut feeling is that Ohio will not go blue, but I'd be happy to be wrong.

[viatroy]

[Mrs. Peel]

Geez, thanks for that cold water shower, Tracy.

[embiggen]

no crying and no boasting! it's not over yet!!!!