The inevitable sell out post

[Beltmann]

Quick question

[oceanman]

I love you cryptique.

 

Remember Jeffs comments on how if he couldn't write a dirty soul record,then all the bastards won.........the Bin Ladens and George Bush's.That doesn't reflect an artist who sets out to make commercial records!

[Good Old Neon]

Oh, Jesus Ass-Fucking Christ on a Skateboard, is this bullshit still carrying on? I can't leave you kids for two minutes, swear to cod.

 

jnickerson (et al), you need to get down off your fucking high horse. This "I am the arbiter of all that is right and true in the world of Art" just makes you look like the biggest knob on the planet. The world hasn't changed because a Wilco song is being played in a commercial. No one's being hurt by it. Their music doesn't suddenly suck because of it. And, contrary to what you obviously think, their ability to carry on as artists has not been compromised.

 

At the end of the day, artists gotta eat. Right? You do realize that, don't you? Sure you do, because you're a "gifted artist" (your words) who hasn't sold his soul to the commercial mainstream. Well, goody goody two-shoes for you. I'm sure your lofty principles help you sleep better at night. But don't imagine for a minute that they entitle you to sit in judgment over others, especially a group of guys who sweat to put out great music and play great shows for the likes of you.

 

I just get so disgusted when people like you decide to take up the mantle of True Art. Who elected you? Who appointed you? More importantly, why the fuck should we care what you think? Art is what it is. Sometimes it's private, sometimes it's public, sometimes it's transcendent, sometimes it's utilitarian, sometimes it's commercial. Why do you get to draw the lines that decide what it is and what it isn't? ...how it can be used, and how it can't? ...who should profit from it, and how much?

 

The act of selling a painting is an act of commerce. If you sell it to a museum or corporation for a large sum of money, isn't that "selling out," by your definition? If not, why is it different from selling a 30-second snippet to Volkswagen?

 

I seriously think you need to take a look around and reconsider your worldview, if this kind of thing gets you this upset. Take a step back. Ask yourself if it really bothers you, or if you just let it bother you because it seems somehow cooler or more artistically principled to do so.

 

That's all I got. I didn't even bother to read the last couple of pages of this shite, so hopefully I haven't rehashed any previous posts.

 

Give me a day or so, and I

[Beltmann]

Wilco has always shyed away from making political statements, including economic ones.

 

The cash machine is blue and green

For a hundred in twenties and a small service fee

I could spend three dollars and sixty-three cents

On Diet Coca-Cola and unlit cigarettes

[ction]

Some of you people are clearing not recognizing that this just might be the worst thing that's ever happened.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Give me a day or so, and I

[socbret]

It's looking more and more like a brave new world is what's in store for us.

[Beltmann]

Some of you people are clearing not recognizing that this just might be the worst thing that's ever happened.

No, we're not talking about how Nels Cline has ruined Wilco with his Muzak.

[OOO]

2 more posts and you win!!!!

 

[Good Old Neon]

A DAY OR SO?!?1 You're the same person who, why, two pages ago, said TIME WAS MONEY!!! If you don't hurry up with that I'm gonna own a VW and be fucking confused, man!

 

Really - I did - care to quote me on that???

[oceanman]

Is anyone having emotional highs and lows with this thread?

 

From laughing my ass off,to wanting Mod powers?

[Guest Speed Racer]

It

[Good Old Neon]

Songs carry emotional information and some transport us back to a poignant time, place or event in our lives. It's no wonder a corporation would want to hitch a ride on the spell these songs cast and encourage you to buy soft drinks, underwear or automobiles while you're in the trance. Artists who take money for ads poison and pervert their songs. It reduces them to the level of a jingle, a word that describes the sound of change in your pocket, which is what your songs become. Remember, when you sell your songs for commercials, you are selling your audience as well. - Tom Waits

[caliber66]

Okay, we've got two pages here in the last hour or so. I'm looking at a pretty quiet day at work tomorrow, so I'd like all of you (Beltmann especially ) to put some serious time in on the late shift so I have something to keep me occupied.

 

Rock over London, rock on Chicago. Gillette, the best a man can get.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Is anyone having emotinal highs and lows with this thread?

 

From laughing my ass off,to wanting Mod powers?

 

Are you kidding? I just clipped the electrical tape on my ethernet cord so I could watch Freaks and Geeks while actually living it (wifi be acting up on this blustery evening).

[Beltmann]

I like Tom Waits, I respect Tom Waits, and I think Tom Waits is wrong--because while the songs may exist, sometimes, as a jingle, they don't have to become wholly a jingle. A song with genuine artistic power transcends the occasional commercial use.

[OOO]

I'll PM someone $5 to do a nice photoshop job on the album cover "The Who Sell Out" and pull Jeff's head on Pete's head and Nel's (or John, your choice) on Roger's. Make sure you get the font down for the text as its rather bubbly and just any text won't do. Any well done visual puns including, but not limited to, the carlos monkey thing, are acceptable as well.

[Good Old Neon]

"Well, as I watch Elvis Costello hawk Lexuses (Lexi?) on TV, I wave goodbye to one of the last holdouts from the pre-80's era. Its now assumed that if you were a rock star with any integrity from this era, you now have no problem using your song about "social revolution" to sell jeans, trucks and Carnival cruises. The Who, Dylan, The Clash, Iggy Pop, Mellancamp, Sting...the list is long and depressing. The only holdouts remain Neil Young and Bruuuce, who turned down $12 million to use Born in the USA for Chevy.

 

And then there's the wave of new bands that are ready and willing to have their art help in the sale of widgets. The Shins shill for McDonald's, Modest Mouse for minivans, White Stripes for Coke, Iron & Wine for M&M's, Postal Service for UPS, The Go! Team for Honda, Of Montreal for Outback Fucking Steakhouse, and Moby for....well, everything.

 

What's odd is that the great bands of the mid-80's to mid-90's avoided such tactics like the plague, and they continue to today. In the 80's, bands like Fugazi, Sonic Youth, the Pixies and R.E.M. set a clear precedent that such behavior was taboo and cheapened the value of your music. R.E.M. continued this into the 90's, turning down millions to use 'Its the End of the World as We Know It' for Windows 95, saying "our music is not for sale". - Blue Grass Roots

[oceanman]

I can't waite to put another Wilco sticker on my VW,and drive to Shell gas station and get a pack of Camel Lights,while listening to MC Hammer!

[ction]

for (not to) oceanman:

 

I love how selling the use of a few songs in VW ads is some sort of cardinal sin...while apparently making records and videos for Warner Brothers, touring in support of Sheryl Crow, selling $30 t-shirts at Clear Channel venues, marketing themselves through soundtrack and talk show appearances, etc. is all pure, non-commercial art.

[froggie]

hang on, let me grab a beer...

[FixedBayonet]

Hummingbird

(for advertising purposes only)

 

His goal in life was to own a Vee-Dub

Riding alone, town after town, toll after toll

A family four-seater with an engine like an egg-beater

 

We appear in commercials

If its a car or just a beer

the bucks can fix anything

A German import who'd have thought it important

to consult with our fanbase

 

So we never did

 

Remember to dismember me

For trying to support my family

But the car goes fast, like a hummingbird

 

My goal in life was to write some good tunes

The type of sound that gets around then shot down

by dissenters

But in the deep chrome bumpers of Volkswagen campers

I don't see any reflection

but my own

 

Now I have cash like a mountain

No need for sleeping bags underneath the stars

when I can lie awake counting

And great wads of cash beats a Wall Street Crash

So I don't have to

Die poor

 

 

**With extreme apologies to Jeff Tweedy and the rest of the blokes in Wilco

[socbret]

jnickerson, it seems to me, with you're general outlook on life and whatnot, you would want to be tackling bigger issues than Wilco having an unreleased song (which was written for Solomon Burke) in a vw commerical.

[mountain bed]

hang on, let me grab a beer...

this is moving faster than a concert webcast thread!

 

:: grabs another beer::

[blindgonzo]