New and Improved 3-ply election thread...

[kwall]

I'm not quite sure I understand your logic behind the opposition not being bipartisan other than your mantra of, "It's always Republicans' fault," but when the vote comes down 228-205 with 40% of Democrats voting against it, I'm not sure I see the highly partisan nature of the opposition.

logic? haha. good one. these are people who are convinced that even natural disasters are partisan events.

[Good Old Neon]

kwall

 

logic? haha. good one. these this are people is a guy who are is convinced that even natural disasters are partisan events that believes god interceded on behalf of Cambrian pikaia.

 

Fixed it for you.

 

And find me one person on here who is convinced natural disaster's are partisan events. There's a canyon sized distinction between holding the federal government responsible, up to and including Bush, for the post-Katrina response vs. blaming the occurence of a hurricane on a political party.

[lost highway]

Well everyone knows the last time God was on the side of the Republicans was during abolition. Since the start of World War II the great and infinite father of fathers has sided closely with the democrats and most of the natural disasters on U.S. soil has been the Lord's way of punishing America for falling into the grips of a republican leader. If you are uncertain of this kind of favoritism please consult the book of Exodus.

[John Smith]

You should probably aim a little of that hatred in the direction of Nancy Pelosi and Barney Frank.

 

I'm not quite sure I understand your logic behind the opposition not being bipartisan other than your mantra of, "It's always Republicans' fault," but when the vote comes down 228-205 with 40% of Democrats voting against it, I'm not sure I see the highly partisan nature of the opposition.

 

The whole point of the bill was for it to pass with support from both sides. Democrats provided 60% of their members to vote for this unpopular and wasteful bill. Republicans provided 33% of their members so they were short on their promise to make the bill bi-partisan (hint hint equal numbers that total up to a veto proof majority to at least give the illusion that this pig was acceptable to congress.) Republicans wer 1/3 short on their support and 2/3 high on their opposition.

 

Before you take Boners word that Pelosi's "Partisan" Speach before the vote was the reason for the failure. I suggest you not take his word and read what she said and point out the partisanship. By the way Barney Frank put it best when he said so they get mad at Nancy Pelosi and punish the rest of the country?

 

Here it is:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey3ZlsmIkz4

 

Face it the republicans could nto deliver their quota and probably never intended to. I'm glad the bill got sh*t canned, it sucks it's horrible, but the republicans f*&ked it up in a bad way with how they have handeled the failure on the vote.

[kwall]

Fixed it for you.

i never claimed to know that god interceded on behalf of anything. i have no idea. i merely challenged you on your assertion that it was clearly a matter of chance. my point was that neither of us knows whether or not there is a creative force in the universe or when or where or how such a creative force might be in action.

[kwall]

I'm glad the bill got sh*t canned, it sucks it's horrible, but the republicans f*&ked it up in a bad way with how they have handeled the failure on the vote.

even when they do something you agree with, they're still wrong.

[mountain bed]

I don't care who's to blame for the bill not getting passed - dammit the time has come to step up to the plate and DO SOMETHING - if I were 65 and was using the stock market as a way to support a fixed income I'd be hysterical right now.

 

I don't even want to call my folks right now.

[Basil II]

re: waste in defense spending brought up earlier, most of you probably know that the u.s. now spends more on our military (and military ventures) than all the rest of the countries in the world combined. strange? lopsided beyond belief? here the years vary only slightly and are all twenty-first-century figures:

 

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/spending.htm

 

$623 billion -- u.s. military expenditures

$500 billion -- the rest of the world, including $65 billion by china, $50 billion by russia, and it's downward from there.

 

i'm no economist, but really, what does this tell the world about our priorities?

 

 

And.....it's been that way since 1945!!

 

-Robert

[Party @ the Moontower]

the republicans could not deliver their quota and probably never intended to. I'm glad the bill got sh*t canned, it sucks it's horrible, but the republicans f*&ked it up in a bad way with how they have handled the failure on the vote.

 

 

Nice to see the republicans playing foolish games with our future. How thoughtful of them.

 

Today on the campaign trail of bullshit McCain is going ape-shit blaming O, dems, and Bad Nancy while acting like he was single handley saving our country from the boogey man. Has he forgotten every single lamo word he has spewed concerning this bullshit has been recorded on the telly? America isn't buying the lame blame-game bull shit. He will do and say anything to win. What a loser.

 

Meanwhile, O stays calm telling us that the House will consider a revised plan which most likey will be an improvement over the rejected one. Calm the f down McCain.Way to stay level headed under a crisis. Stay away from toys with sharp edges and books with actual facts in them.

 

[bleedorange]

The whole point of the bill was for it to pass with support from both sides. Democrats provided 60% of their members to vote for this unpopular and wasteful bill. Republicans provided 33% of their members so they were short on their promise to make the bill bi-partisan (hint hint equal numbers that total up to a veto proof majority to at least give the illusion that this pig was acceptable to congress.) Republicans wer 1/3 short on their support and 2/3 high on their opposition.

 

Before you take Boners word that Pelosi's "Partisan" Speach before the vote was the reason for the failure. I suggest you not take his word and read what she said and point out the partisanship. By the way Barney Frank put it best when he said so they get mad at Nancy Pelosi and punish the rest of the country?

 

Here it is:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey3ZlsmIkz4

 

Face it the republicans could nto deliver their quota and probably never intended to. I'm glad the bill got sh*t canned, it sucks it's horrible, but the republicans f*&ked it up in a bad way with how they have handeled the failure on the vote.

 

 

I'm not taking Boehner's word on anything. It's funny though that Pelosi would take the time to give a speech outlining Bush turning Clinton's surplus into deficits, as if that had anything to do with the problems we face today. (Before you focus on that, I'm not absolving Bush of any blame for the decline of the dollar or the vast increases in government spending over the last eight years. I understand all of that. I'm solely focusing on this issue.)

 

And how can you take anything Barney Frank says on this matter with a straight face. If you had to blame one person for this entire mess, his name would be at the top of the list. And now he's bemoaning non-passage of this bill, which allows us to pay for his incompetence? Of course, he's upset it didn't pass.

 

Fannie Mae's Patron Saint

 

I also don't understand why you think that a horrible bill that gets rammed through to a vote and didn't pass is unacceptable and evidence of Republicans' partisanship. So now it's bad to vote against a rushed, terrible bill that the majority of the country doesn't want? What have we come to now?

[viatroy]

They can't be mad that Pelosi blasted Bush's economic policies at this point

 

 

 

"may you live in interesting times"

[sweetheart-mine]

And.....it's been that way since 1945!!

 

-Robert

well, that's even more interesting, thank you for the info.

it was only since the current "war" began that i started to absorb the kind of money we spend on what is called defense.

[Tweedling]

Is Barney Frank really Elmer Fudd?

[MrRain422]

Blaming Pelosi's speech is just plain dumb. The Republicans who are complaining about it are basically saying, yes, there's a crisis, yes, we need to do something about it ASAP, yes, we think this bill was good, but we voted against it because our feelings are hurt. What sort of basis is that for a vote?

 

I have mixed feelings about the bill anyway. I don't think I'm upset it didn't pass. But that reasoning is just stupid, and it certainly isn't putting country first.

[viatroy]

Is Barney Frank really Elmer Fudd?

 

 

I was wondering if he's missing his upper plate.

 

 

I was surprised but not disappointed it failed by any means. Now they can go back and hopefully tighten it up and answer some questions. It still all sounds pretty loosey goosey to me --- eh, 200 billion here, 350 there, don't worry about the details.

[Tweedling]

I was wondering if he's missing his upper plate.

Ahhhh, now I think I kinda feel bad.

I was surprised but not disappointed it failed by any means. Now they can go back and hopefully tighten it up and answer some questions. It still all sounds pretty loosey goosey to me --- eh, 200 billion here, 350 there, don't worry about the details.

 

That just about sums up the way I feel about the bill.

[Party @ the Moontower]

I just realized 2 minutes ago that the reason I ditched my college degree & that million dollar job for a career in massage therapy (which I love ) is because my education @ UCM left me over-prepared, my brain stuffed with too much information, and hurt my feelings.

 

 

 

 

can't wait for thursday

[bjorn_skurj]

If a delay in the return of the stability of the financial system results in a credit-tightening that results in my company not being able to borrow money to meet payroll some week down the line, that would suck. Just sayin'.

[Edie]

I just keep wondering when some non-finance company like ADM or GE or something will suddenly default on its loans and have its credit rating (and stock price) plummet. The crisis is real -- short term debt that is routinely lent and paid back is basically frozen right now, and not just here, but globally. This is one of the engines that drives our country and allows big and small business to conduct business and do simple things like make payroll. So the relative misconception that this was driven by "wall street fat cats" is largely wrong and worse, paints the problem with a frighteningly broad brush that could literally undo our "main street" economy.

 

How many of you that have home equity lines of credit have gotten a letter cutting your line? A bunch of people I know have, and they have great credit and often have little or nothing borrowed. Yet the letter came anyway.

[bleedorange]

Blaming Pelosi's speech is just plain dumb. The Republicans who are complaining about it are basically saying, yes, there's a crisis, yes, we need to do something about it ASAP, yes, we think this bill was good, but we voted against it because our feelings are hurt. What sort of basis is that for a vote?

 

 

This isn't accurate. Boehner was the only one making this ridiculous claim about Pelosi's speech being the reason for the vote, and it was clearly speculation on his part. The fact that Frank and Pelosi were leading the way on this bill should have been reason enough to vote against it.

[bjorn_skurj]

Some friends of mine might lose their house because they can't refinance their mortgage. Middle-class people are going to suffer for this. The people who caused it will by and large suffer no more than having additional free time on their hands.

[kwall]

The fact that Frank and Pelosi were leading the way on this bill should have been reason enough to vote against it.

not to mention that the people don't want it.

[Edie]

"People who don't want it" will be the first in line for it soon enough.

[bjorn_skurj]

They're not gonna want the alternative even more, I predict.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

I would wager a revised bill will be passed within a week.