You And I

[Guest Speed Racer]

I'm interested in what makes us tick.

 

So ask someone why they have their opinion instead of accusing them (and indirectly, no less) of "pure indie rock credibility crap." Accustations are on par with one-word assessments in terms of making productive conversation screech to a halt. It's pure baiting, and twice as bad when you don't even have the gall to call the person out directly.

 

I don't like One Wing.

[Good Old Neon]

Oh, I'm going to call this how I see it. I think the internet does allow bomb throwing without consequence, but in terms of the music, I think this outspoken loathing of "You and I" is pure indie rock credibility crap.

 

This is the same crap that causes people to completely discredit Kings of Leon because they have achieved wide ranging success. (has the actual music really changed that much between their first record and the last?????)

 

This is of course seen in all genres. I'm by no means a heavy metal guru but I found the outcry quite silly when Metallica released the Black Album. Is It wrong that they just created an album that had actual quality songs?????

 

I think "You and I" appears to easy or obvious to indie hipsters and therefore has to be written off as having some sinister motive of "wanting to be heard". Oh God!

 

The same group that yells sellout when Wilco pushes their music on Volkswagon commericials because God knows with all the exposure from radio Wilco is just being spoon fed to the masses?

 

The ironic thing, is because I listen to what people consider not mainstream music, I'm accused of being a snob about this, but I could care less if Avett Brothers or Death Cab sign to a major label or not, I could care less what song is promoted on what commercial or tv show, or what album hits it big or not. I care about if I like the music.

 

All that being said, I like "You and I". I love singing along to it. I love the duet, I love how Feist's timing is off. I think it is catchy. I'm a dad, so what does that make me __________________________?

 

At 38, I’m well, well past the point at which I give a rat’s ass about my indie cred – and even if I did, I’ve been away from the “scene” for so long, that, aside from my wife, my 3 year old daughter, and a few close friends, there’s no one around to impress.

 

I always skip You and I…and I still think the Volkswagen thing was highly unfortunate, as, rightly or wrongly, justifiably or not, it ruined my enjoyment of that album, and tarnished my image of Wilco, the band.

[nodep5]

At 38, I’m well, well past the point at which I give a rat’s ass about my indie cred – and even if I did, I’ve been away from the “scene” for so long, that, aside from my wife, my 3 year old daughter, and a few close friends, there’s no one around to impress.

 

I always skip You and I…and I still think the Volkswagen thing was highly unfortunate, as, rightly or wrongly, justifiably or not, it ruined my enjoyment of that album, and tarnished my image of Wilco, the band.

 

Well I'm sorry that the Volkswagon thing didn't fly with you. The silver lining is that some people maybe got turned on to Wilco via those commericals and I think that is cool.

 

As far as You and I, what specifically causes you to skip it? Just interested.

[Good Old Neon]

Well I'm sorry that the Volkswagon thing didn't fly with you. The silver lining is that some people maybe got turned on to Wilco via those commericals and I think that is cool.

 

As far as You and I, what specifically causes you to skip it? Just interested.

 

It’s hard to articulate, it just doesn’t work for me…the chorus, aside from not appealing to me, is repetitive, it just sort of goes on and on, long past the point of interest.

[Dude]

Well I'm sorry that the Volkswagon thing didn't fly with you. The silver lining is that some people maybe got turned on to Wilco via those commericals and I think that is cool.

 

On top of portraying the defanged, cuddly Wilco of The Thanks I Get, the commercials themselves had nauseatingly cute plotlines that really didn't do the band justice (or the cars, for that matter).

 

Now, if they had used "I dreamed about killing you again last night and it felt alright to me", THAT would have made for an innerestin' ad.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Now, if they had used "I dreamed about killing you again last night and it felt alright to me", THAT would have made for an innerestin' ad.

 

The 2010 Volkswagan Passat: More trunk space than any other mid-sized sedan. Now with stain-resistant interiors.

[W(TF)]

Can't answer for Neon...but in my opinion, Y&I is a lovely composition, only it's written much more in "Feist's style" rather than Tweedy's. It's a bit saccharine, but it has more than enough minor chords to hold my interest. I enjoy that song quite a lot. The only part that sounds "lightweight" to me is the drumming-- but I've never heard W(TA) on a decent stereo at high volume, where you can probably hear clearly the subtleties of what Glenn's trying to do. Some different arrangements would be nice, maybe more piano and harmonies (get John and Pat's voices into the mix)?

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

At 38, I’m well, well past the point at which I give a rat’s ass about my indie cred – and even if I did, I’ve been away from the “scene” for so long, that, aside from my wife, my 3 year old daughter, and a few close friends, there’s no one around to impress.

 

I always skip You and I…and I still think the Volkswagen thing was highly unfortunate, as, rightly or wrongly, justifiably or not, it ruined my enjoyment of that album, and tarnished my image of Wilco, the band.

 

 

How do you feel about Ray Lamontagne? The Flaming Lips? Feist? The Beatles? The Kinks? Etta James? Squeeze? Blondie? Roy Orbison? Daft Punk? Bob Dylan? Wynton freaking Marsalis? Is Wilco's sell out more sell outy than these artists?

[Dude]

The 2010 Volkswagan Passat: More trunk space than any other mid-sized sedan. Now with stain-resistant interiors.

[nodep5]

It’s hard to articulate, it just doesn’t work for me…the chorus, aside from not appealing to me, is repetitive, it just sort of goes on and on, long past the point of interest.

 

I hear ya, I feel that way at times about "you never know".

[GLHawk]

I would like to state again for the record that "You and I" is not a good song. It is a great song.

 

Those who think it's easy to write a love song that doesn't suck should try it sometime. The fact that Tweedy can follow "Bull Black Nova" with something like this only cements my admiration for him as a songwriter.

 

It certainly could have been a radio hit, but probably in a different era. Not enough sex, violence or auto-tune for today's radio audience. Plus as we have seen, even a lot of Wilco's own core audience has a knee-jerk hatred for it.

[Good Old Neon]

 

Those who think it's easy to write a love song that doesn't suck should try it sometime. The fact that Tweedy can follow "Bull Black Nova" with something like this only cements my admiration for him as a songwriter.

 

For me, it has nothing to do with the subject matter, and everything to do with execution.

 

It certainly could have been a radio hit, but probably in a different era. Not enough sex, violence or auto-tune for today's radio audience. Plus as we have seen, even a lot of Wilco's own core audience has a knee-jerk hatred for it.

 

See, I think it’s the opposite – it sounds a little too radio friendly, and not unlike the sort of bland easy listening stuff folks tend to enjoy listening to while at work. If it were not a Wilco song, how many fans would actively seek it out?

[nodep5]

See, I think it’s the opposite – it sounds a little too radio friendly, and not unlike the sort of bland easy listening stuff folks tend to enjoy listening to while at work. If it were not a Wilco song, how many fans would actively seek it out?

 

 

If you are speaking of the sweet tunes that you hear at the dentist's office, then I think Wilco would take that as a compliment. Why do people hate on bands like Bread?

[Guest Speed Racer]

If you are speaking of the sweet tunes that you hear at the dentist's office, then I think Wilco would take that as a compliment. Why do people hate on bands like Bread?

 

Anyone anywhere whose artistic aspirations include reaching an audience with implements in its mouth deserve all the ridicule they can bear, 10x.

 

I hate on bands like Bread because they sound like music + horse tranquilizer. Utterly sedate and boring.

 

I love pop, and I love love songs. That does not mean I like soft rock.

[nodep5]

Anyone anywhere whose artistic aspirations include reaching an audience with implements in its mouth deserve all the ridicule they can bear, 10x.

 

I hate on bands like Bread because they sound like music + horse tranquilizer. Utterly sedate and boring.

 

I love pop, and I love love songs. That does not mean I like soft rock.

 

That is me with my collection of soft pillowy rock. Thank you Bread, the Carpenters, America, that one Dan Fogelberg song, the late night infomercial (you know the one), Roberta Flack, oh, too many to mention. Heaven indeed.

 

I know I have a problem with sarcasm, but don't read this thinking I'm joking. I love that stuff.

[GLHawk]

Anyone anywhere whose artistic aspirations include reaching an audience with implements in its mouth deserve all the ridicule they can bear, 10x.

 

I hate on bands like Bread because they sound like music + horse tranquilizer. Utterly sedate and boring.

 

I love pop, and I love love songs. That does not mean I like soft rock.

 

I'm glad Wilco does not share the genre snobbery of many of its fans.

 

If every Wilco song sounded like this, yes, I would get bored fairly quickly. But there's nothing inherently wrong with "soft rock." A good song is a good song.

 

And this one is good. It's not a saccharine "silly love song," it's an intelligent, adult lyric about maintaining a relationship while accepting that you can never definitively "know" that person.

 

"You and I" is a lot more intelligent than the knee-jerk attacks on it have been.

[bobfrombob]

I'm a fan of "You And I". And I absolutely love the way the duet vocals are just slightly out of synch - the way they get just a little ahead or behind each other from time to time.

[Guest Speed Racer]

I'm glad Wilco does not share the genre snobbery of many of its fans.

 

If every Wilco song sounded like this, yes, I would get bored fairly quickly. But there's nothing inherently wrong with "soft rock." A good song is a good song.

 

And this one is good. It's not a saccharine "silly love song," it's an intelligent, adult lyric about maintaining a relationship while accepting that you can never definitively "know" that person.

 

"You and I" is a lot more intelligent than the knee-jerk attacks on it have been.

 

Have you read my posts? I love the song.

 

I still think aspiring to be dentist's office music is a lousy goal for a band - for Metallica, Arcade Fire, Wilco, Jay-Z, Feist or Bread.

 

As for "genre-snobbery," I just don't like a lot of soft rock. I listen to it and I think, "I don't emotionally connect to this," or "Man, that keyboard grates." I also think that about certain rock, pop and indie songs, but I find that a higher proporption of soft rock songs elicit that response in me. Thus, I have concluded that, like overcooked tomatoes, WonderBread and limp bacon, soft rock, generally speaking (and with exceptions - shock!) does not whet my appetite. Is that alright?

 

Of course, applying your standards to my tastes is not snobbish at all, correct?

[choo-choo-charlie]

I'm a fan of "You And I". And I absolutely love the way the duet vocals are just slightly out of synch - the way they get just a little ahead or behind each other from time to time.

 

That's why I like it too. Listen closely when they sing "misconstrued." It's off just enough to get the point across...

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

I'm glad Wilco does not share the genre snobbery of many of its fans.

 

If every Wilco song sounded like this, yes, I would get bored fairly quickly. But there's nothing inherently wrong with "soft rock." A good song is a good song.

 

And this one is good. It's not a saccharine "silly love song," it's an intelligent, adult lyric about maintaining a relationship while accepting that you can never definitively "know" that person.

 

"You and I" is a lot more intelligent than the knee-jerk attacks on it have been.

There really isn't much logic in this post. I can guarantee you there are genres that Jeff doesn't like, just like Speed Racer can't connect with soft rock. There's nothing wrong with that. If Jeff hates Norwegian death metal, is he exhibiting genre snobbery? Not to mention the fact that you completely missed that SR is one of the ones defending You and I here.

[Guest Speed Racer]

If Jeff hates Norwegian death metal, is he exhibiting genre snobbery?

 

More likely, genre xenophobia.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

More likely, genre xenophobia.

By this logic, everyone on Earth has to like everyone and everything else on Earth, or he's being a snob/xenophobe/racist/what have you.

 

Now excuse me, but I have to go listen to this guy's new EP.

[Guest Speed Racer]

By this logic, everyone on Earth has to like everyone and everything else on Earth, or he's being a snob/xenophobe/racist/what have you.

 

Exactly. Get on board, or I'm reporting you.

[GLHawk]

Have you read my posts? I love the song.

 

I still think aspiring to be dentist's office music is a lousy goal for a band - for Metallica, Arcade Fire, Wilco, Jay-Z, Feist or Bread.

 

As for "genre-snobbery," I just don't like a lot of soft rock. I listen to it and I think, "I don't emotionally connect to this," or "Man, that keyboard grates." I also think that about certain rock, pop and indie songs, but I find that a higher proporption of soft rock songs elicit that response in me. Thus, I have concluded that, like overcooked tomatoes, WonderBread and limp bacon, soft rock, generally speaking (and with exceptions - shock!) does not whet my appetite. Is that alright?

 

Of course, applying your standards to my tastes is not snobbish at all, correct?

Sorry to flame you there. I thought the soft rock comment was part of the "You and I" pile-on; didn't realize the discussion had shifted to Bread. I'm not really familiar with Bread.

 

My sense is that the haters are dismissing "You and I" without giving it a chance because it has that soft-rock feel, and ignoring the content.

 

I'm not saying that "everyone has to like everything." I'm saying that as Wilco fans it doesn't make much sense for us to be close-minded about genres -- they obviously are not. I would never have thought we'd hear Wilco songs influenced by Can or Neu, but we did; for the next album I'm betting on Norwegian death metal.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

Exactly. Get on board, or I'm reporting you.

However, logic says that liking everything means liking that which hates on other things. So, in order to not be a racist, I have to like everyone, including Nazis. But by liking Nazis, I'm indicating support for the extermination of an entire group of people, thus making me more racist than if I just said "I hate Nazis." It's truly a lose-lose situation, making snobbery inevitable.

 

So, to summarize, it's ok to not like soft rock. Which may or may not be the nazi of my analogy. I really don't know.

 

for the next album I'm betting on Norwegian death metal.

We can only hope.