The Hot Stove League

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

I heard on the radio that only 6 years are guaranteed.

[rareair]

i will have to stat up upon my return from the raconteurs this evening to explore your point (excluding him from a top 40 seems a stretch) but this cannot be bad news. i guess the real beef is the amount of money paid.

 

i have no problem with overpaying if the cubs want to act like a big market team.

 

he has to be better than matt murton, and LF is where i would put him.

[bobbob1313]

i will have to stat up upon my return from the raconteurs this evening to explore your point (excluding him from a top 40 seems a stretch) but this cannot be bad news. i guess the real beef is the amount of money paid.

 

i have no problem with overpaying if the cubs want to act like a big market team.

 

he has to be better than matt murton, and LF is where i would put him.

 

He's your center fielder.

[rareair]

He's your center fielder.

 

 

 

 

 

at least he still gets to hit. who is your 40th best player, raul ibanez?

[bobbob1313]

at least he still gets to hit. who is your 40th best player, raul ibanez?

 

You caught me, Raul Ibanez is definetly on my short list of better players than Alfonso Soriano.

 

Ibanez career OPS: .813

Soriano: .835

 

 

Not as drastic a difference as you'd like it to be, plus he's a plus defender at center, whereas Soriano has been below average every year but last year.

 

But no, Ibanez wouldn't be ahead of him. But there are two players on his own team that are better than him, not to mention one pitcher. He's way overrated because of his steals, keep in mind he had two very average seasons in the 2nd best hitters park in the league. His 04-05 numbers would look even worse if he didn't play at the launching pad those 2 years.

[MrRain422]

This year, though, he put up monster numbers in an extreme pitchers park.

 

No, I don't think he'll repeat that again. But I think you may be shortchanging him some. It's not just the steals. He does have excellent power too, even if it's not really as good as this year would indicate.

 

Putting him in centerfield is pretty fucking stupid though.

[bobbob1313]

Even with his great year last year, he still didn't make the top 10 in Slug. and wasn't anywhere close to the top 10 in OBP. He also strikes out too much for the little amount of walks he has.

 

I will say that he's best off in the leadoff role, so seeing as that is the smart thing to do, we can be assured that the cubs will do the opposite, and bat him cleanup.

[Oil Can Boyd]

And Nomar stays in LA for two more years ...

[cryptique]

And Nomar stays in LA for two more years ...

That's probably good for parties on all sides -- the Dodgers, Nomar, and Mia.

[Oil Can Boyd]

And Alex Gonzalez signs with the Reds (3 years/$14 million).

I am sorry to see him go from the Red Sox. I know he couldn't hit a whole lot but he sure was smooth in the field.

[bobbob1313]

And Nomar stays in LA for two more years ...

 

He really cashed in, seeing as he was basically league average for a 1B last year, it looks like they overpaid.

 

 

Ryan Howard won the NL MVP, which I'm not sure I agree with. He had great stats, but he does play in a pretty extreme hitters park, and his team didn't even make the playoffs with arguably a better supporting cast than Pujols had. There is not a singe other player on the Cards that is as good as Chase Utley, and with the exception of Carpenter, the Phils had an arguably better pitching staff. I don't think he was as valuable as Pujols, who keeps on getting robbed. I think he's been so consistent that every time a guy like Howard or Beltre comes out and has a monster season, they will see it as being more valuable than Pujols, simply because of the improvement.

[MrRain422]

I agree that Pujols was more deserving, but Howard at least isn't a bad pick. He had an MVP season, just not the best MVP season out there. Deserving, just not the most deserving. There have been much worse award picks in recent memory (see: 2005 AL CY).

[Sir Stewart]

There have been much worse award picks in recent memory (see: 2005 AL CY).

I still can't believe they gave that to ction.

[bobbob1313]

The Marlins made two minor trades today:

 

One with the Mets, who get Adam Bostick and Jason Vargas, a couple of hard throwing lefties who could develop into above average pitchers. Vargas looked like a pretty decent #4-5 starter before he completely lost his control and started walking a batter an inning. If he doesn't develop as a pitcher, he could convert into an outfielder, as he swings a really nice bat. The Marlins got a couple of hard throwing relievers.

 

We also traded the guy I wanted to close for us next year, Chris Resop, to the Padres for a minor leaguer. Resop has good stuff, and he throws pretty hard, so he may be a good reliever down the road.

[Oil Can Boyd]

"I think the money isn't that important to me. I'm not looking for the money."

 

Why do people who are going to be making $136 million say things like that?

[bobbob1313]

"I think the money isn't that important to me. I'm not looking for the money."

 

Why do people who are going to be making $136 million say things like that?

 

Because apparently it is bad to want to make as much money as possible.

[MrRain422]

Yeah, I don't blame athletes for chasing the money. Yeah, the difference between 7 million and 8 million seems minor to us peons who won't make that in our lifetimes. But hey, their careers are over by the time they're 40 for most of them. Why not get what they can in the mean time?

[MattZ]

Because apparently it is bad to want to make as much money as possible.

 

I dont blame athletes for chasing the money. Not at all -- its what everyone would do in that situation. But I also think its naive to pretend that fans shouldn't become disillusioned with it. Especially since -- rightly or wrongly -- many fans develop what they perceive as a special relationship with their teams and those players. When the players from those teams go to a rival for a few more millions (e.g., Johnny Damon anyone?) it is a violent slap in the face reminder that sports are a business and that while Mets fans hate Yankee fans, most Met players couldn't care less about any perceived rivalry between crosstown teams.

 

Fans get into the habit of referring to their team as "us" or "we" -- when players leave for more money elsewhere it reminds fans that there is no us or we. Its a bitter pill to swallow, but I understand both sides of it.

 

Bobbob - do you have any other info on the Marlins/Mets trade? I cant find anything on it anywhere.

[bobbob1313]

Bobbob - do you have any other info on the Marlins/Mets trade? I cant find anything on it anywhere.

 

The Florida Marlins made a pair of trades Monday, acquiring two pitchers from the New York Mets and another from the Los Angeles Angels.

 

Florida sent left-handers Adam Bostick and Jason Vargas to the Mets in exchange for right-handers Matt Lindstrom and Henry Owens. Also Monday, the Marlins got right-hander Kevin Gregg from the Angels for right-hander Chris Resop.

 

"Both of the trades we were involved in today addressed our bullpen needs,'' Marlins general manager Larry Beinfest said. "We expect all three players acquired today to contribute to our club during the 2007 season.''

 

Resop and Vargas both spent some time with the Marlins last season; Resop went 1-2 with a 3.38 ERA in 22 relief appearances, while Vargas was 1-2 with a 7.33 ERA in 12 appearances, five of them starts.

 

Gregg appeared in two postseasons with the Angels, throwing two scoreless innings against the Boston Red Sox in the 2004 AL Division Series, then throwing two more shutout innings against the Chicago White Sox in the 2005 AL Championship Series.

 

Gregg was 3-4 with a 4.14 ERA in 32 games, including two starts, last season for the Angels.

 

Owens

[MattZ]

...

 

Thanks - wish I could give you an impression of who the mets gave up, but I dont know anything about either of them. Seems like Minaya is going the very predictable "let's stock up on lefties" route. I remember seeing Vargas at one point last year and being impressed with him. I am starting to get frustrated with the Mets continuing to go after guys that have good stuff but just haven't put it together yet -- and its all because Rick Peterson has convinced the front office that he can fix any problem. News flash to Fred Wilpon: he can't (e.g., Victor Zambrano).

 

Either way, its always interesting when division rivals pull off a trade.

[bobbob1313]

Thanks - wish I could give you an impression of who the mets gave up, but I dont know anything about either of them. Seems like Minaya is going the very predictable "let's stock up on lefties" route. I remember seeing Vargas at one point last year and being impressed with him. I am starting to get frustrated with the Mets continuing to go after guys that have good stuff but just haven't put it together yet -- and its all because Rick Peterson has convinced the front office that he can fix any problem. News flash to Fred Wilpon: he can't (e.g., Victor Zambrano).

 

Either way, its always interesting when division rivals pull off a trade.

 

I don't know how I feel about the trade. The reaction on the Marlin boards is that somebody must've slipped something into Larry Beinfest's drink, but I personally think it was a preemptive move on both team's part. The Marlins or Mets might have been looking to take one of those players via the Rule V draft, so they decided to trade them anyways, thus giving them the roster flexibility to send them down to AAA if they need to.

 

From a Mets fan on the Marlin board:

 

Lindstrom throws 100 MPH straight as an arrow. There's a reason he never got a chance with the the Mets -- he's not very good. Henry Owens is the much better pitcher. Owens has a nasty fastball and is working on a slider. Iffy control, but he looks like a keeper. Potential closer material.

 

 

I like the sound of this Henry Owens kid. He struck out 12.4 in the Minors in 6 seasons, and last year he was absolutely disgusting, striking out 74 in 40 innings, with only 10 walks. 1.58 era in AA, so I hope he can make the jump.

[MrRain422]

LOOGY = my favorite baseball term

[bobbob1313]

LOOGY = my favorite baseball term

 

Definetly.

[bjorn_skurj]

This is the guy that pees on his hands, no?

 

Mets complete deal with Alou, decline option on Glavine

By MIKE FITZPATRICK

AP Baseball Writer

 

NEW YORK (AP) - Moises Alou gives the New York Mets a proven right-handed hitter to play left field _ and another aging regular.

 

The 40-year-old slugger finalized an $8.5 million, one-year contract on Monday with the NL East champions, who also declined their $14 million option on left-hander Tom Glavine and swapped young pitchers with the Florida Marlins in a four-player trade.

 

Alou's deal includes a $7.5 million club option for 2008 with $1 million buyout. The six-time All-Star, who gets a $7.5 million salary next season, said he turned down two-year offers from other teams to join the Mets.

 

"The length of my contract doesn't really matter at this point in my career," Alou said. "I wanted to come here because this year _ I wanted to win this year."

 

New York reached Game 7 of the NL championship series this year before losing to the St. Louis Cardinals, who went on to win the World Series. Glavine was a big part of that success, going 15-7 with a 3.82 ERA during the season and 2-1 with a 1.59 ERA in three playoff starts.

 

But he will be 41 when next season begins and is deciding between staying in New York and trying to return home to Atlanta. Earlier this month, the two-time NL Cy Young Award winner declined his $7.5 million option to stay with the Mets, who would like to keep him for the right price.

 

"We hope to continue to speak with the agent, negotiate, and hopefully be able to bring Tommy back," general manager Omar Minaya said. "We let them know ahead of time that we were going to make this move."

 

Even if Glavine departs, the Mets will have plenty of veterans on the field next year. They recently re-signed 41-year-old pitcher Orlando Hernandez to a $12 million, two-year contract and retained 37-year-old second baseman Jose Valentin with a $3.8 million, one-year deal.

 

They brought in 37-year-old backup infielder Damion Easley, adding him to a bench that already includes 48-year-old Julio Franco.

 

All-Star catcher Paul Lo Duca will turn 35 in April, and right fielder Shawn Green is 34. Two of New York's best players, however, are 23: David Wright and Jose Reyes.

 

The Mets did add a pair of young pitchers Monday, acquiring left-handers Jason Vargas and Adam Bostick from Florida for hard-throwing prospects Henry Owens and Matt Lindstrom.

 

Vargas and Bostick are both 23. Owens and Lindstrom are both right-handers.

 

In other moves, the Mets also claimed right-hander Jason Standridge off waivers from Cincinnati and purchased the contract of outfielder Carlos Gomez from Double-A Binghamton.

 

Limited to 98 games last season because of ankle and back injuries, Alou hit .301 with 22 homers and 74 RBIs in 345 at-bats for San Francisco. He takes over in left field for popular veteran Cliff Floyd, hobbled by an Achilles' tendon problem for much of the year.

 

"That's the only reason why I'm back playing in '07. I was a little frustrated last season because of the little injuries that I had," Alou said, adding that he's completely healthy now. "I felt great after July. I feel good at the plate. I feel strong. I feel young."

 

His right-handed bat should help balance a potent lineup that struggled at times against left-handed pitching late last season. Alou batted .349 (29-for-83) against left-handers this year and is a .301 career hitter with 319 homers and 1,229 RBIs in 15 major league seasons with Pittsburgh, Montreal, Florida, Houston, the Chicago Cubs and Giants.

 

"I'm still producing," Alou said.

[bobbob1313]

Yep, and he can still hit so I'd say it's a good move by the Mets. If they hadn't called Milledge up last year, this would be an even better move, as he still needs time in the minors, but his arbitration years have already started.