Talk about a grower

[keeprighton2]

wow, I'm genuinely surprised by some of the views airing here.

 

I am a recently converted Wilco fan in all honesty, and after discovering SBS, I could not stop listening to it.

 

I can't see why people can see this album as boring really, the amazing soloing of Nels, Glenn's fantastic beats and yet more lyrical beauty from Jeff.

 

Listening to previous albums, this record seems to have more of an upbeat feeling and of positivity in comparison to the previous records, and as a collection of songs and individually, I can repeat earlier sentiments about how I think this is one of the greatest records ever.

 

But I have to ask, exactly what is it about SBS that you don't like? Personally, it ticks all the boxes but I'd like to see what you all think about it.

 

In answer to your question I don't dislike the record, I just find it a little bland, and in all honesty I don't think the tunes are Tweedy's best. I had the good fortune to talk to him about it for a little while in Dublin back in November and mentioned that the response had been lukewarm and he seemed a little taken aback. He told me he thought it was some of his best work, and I can see what he means in terms of it being 'accomplished'.

I suppose it's because the regular Wilco audience wants the band to go to new places and be 'challenging' and in terms of the overall sound and feel of the record it's kind of backward looking, not 'alternative' enough, if you like.

 

However, it does have the ingredients to take the band to a wider audience and even though the hardcore probably won't like that idea, you can see why the band will want to do that, after all they have a living to make and lives to pursue. Its never easy I suppose being commercially successful and retaining your artistic integrity when you've earned yourselves a reputation and blazed a creative trail.

Let's be honest, how many times have music lovers 'dropped' bands they like when they cross over to a wider audience. I know I have. That doesn't necessarily mean unhappiness at 'selling out' but once the secret is out the appeal begins to diminish.

[W(TF)]

However, it does have the ingredients to take the band to a wider audience and even though the hardcore probably won't like that idea, you can see why the band will want to do that, after all they have a living to make and lives to pursue. Its never easy I suppose being commercially successful and retaining your artistic integrity when you've earned yourselves a reputation and blazed a creative trail.

 

I read that SBS is Wilco's most successful release with >400,000 copies sold. I wouldn't really call that a huge commercial success for a 14-year-old band with a worldwide following. Wilco have done a few things lately to sell more records, but I don't thinking changing their musical ethos was one of them.

[Sweet Papa Crimbo]

Time will tell whether the onset of happiness has already consigned Jeff Tweedy's best work to history. However, I'm much more interested in your definitions. I know what you mean by 'alternative' and 'classic rock' insomuch as the former tends to be unusual or experimental and the latter, tried, trusted and familiar. It's undeniable that SBS does not contain many huge YHF-like sonic surprises and, as you say, is closer to most people's idea of AOR. To me though, that's only half the story. I think that one of the reasons a lot of people find SBS boring or disappointing is that it has very little sonic identity or signature, in terms of the ambience created by the use of condenser microphones, reverb, overdubs, edits, strange noises and any number of other standard engineering and production effects and techniques. This kind of ear candy is what we've grown used to hearing (eg "In the deepest ocean.....", awesome reverb on Thom Yorke's vocals at the start of Radiohead's Weird Fishes, but imagine it sung dry) and a bit like special effects in films, we now take for granted. We definitely expect the latest blockbuster from a fairly big time rock band to have all that stuff. That doesn't necessarily mean that SBS is a great 'no frills' album, but whereas the often painstakingly constructed versions of songs found on most albums are nearly always the 'definitive' ones, with SBS I don't think this is the case. Definitive album versions are often difficult to reproduce live, if a lot of production was involved, and production ambience is incredibly difficult to recreate live. SBS has hardly any ambience and that's why I think all the songs sound better live. Right now, I'm finding SBS the weirdest Wilco album, because the shows have become the reference points for its songs, rather than the other way round (which is more often the case). Love it or hate it (I don't hate it, but I'm not sure whether I will ever love it totally), it's non-definitive, and I think that's pretty alternative.

 

 

defeated by wall of text

[W(TF)]

Keep in mind, it's a lot harder to make a great "quiet" album with simple constructs than a sonic thriller. Also, the sheer volume difference between album and live performance accounts for a lot of the difference in excitement....Wilco recorded SBS at their loft, a one-room space, and most of the tunes were cut live with no overdubs. So each of the band members had to tone down their part so as not to drown the others out. This is all pretty well documented.

 

Definitely ironic in that the predecessor (Kicking Television) was "live" but full of overdubs, and had a much more "produced", exciting sound aesthetic. SBS is essentially a real live record, cut flat.

[Sir Stewart]

I have a friend who never like Wilco much and rolled his eyes every time I brought them up. The other day he called me and said "I just listened to Sky Blue Sky all the way through. Ill never say anything bad about Wilco again."

 

This pretty much happened with me and a friend of mine, too. Anytime I brought up Wilco in the past, all he'd say was "fell in love with the drummer/fell in love with the drummer." Every effing time. I played "Hate It Here" and "You Are My Face" for him from the web site stream and he totally did a 180. He even owns Glenn's disc now.

[mathew]

To be perfectly honest as a somewhat music snob/enthusiast and in general student of art I look down on people who would consider Sky Blue Sky

"classic rock" maybe I

[mathew]

To be perfectly honest as a somewhat music snob/enthusiast and in general student of art I look down on people who would consider Sky Blue Sky

"classic rock" maybe I

[Golden Smoghead]

I think SBS is an album of recordings that are pretty, without being attractive. I see SBS as Gwenyth Paltrow. You can see how other people like it, and appreciate it aesthetically, and even WANT to like it yourself -- but ultimately you're going to leave it for Jennifer Lopez because it's too boring.

[radiokills]

i recall a tweedy quote found in the wilco book, i believe its something to this degree:

 

"music and songs are about the instruments working together towards a common goal. i dont think one instrument should stand out among the others"

 

maybe its jim, but still. i hate solos, nels is schwag.

[markosis]

Well, to me YHF and AGIB are 'alternative' albums and SBS is more 'classic rock' or 'AOR' which could be interpreted as nudging middle of the road territory. To my mind most discerning Wilco fans listen to 'alternative' music by choice, hence the lukewarm response to SBS.

 

Well, therein lies a big problem for me. If we could all get past these insidious labels placed upon music mainly by the music industry (whose sins I need not reiterate), our appreciation of music (art) could increase tenfold because we wouldn't be so worried about what we're supposed to like based upon our musical demographic. But we're preprogrammed. We see something an album labeled as "classic rock" and because of our affinity for "alternative" we think said album is "safe." What is the criteria for "classic rock", "alternative", or "safe" music? There is none. Its all smoke and mirrors that distracts us from the heart of the art.

 

If one truly does not like a piece of art, that's cool. But to get caught up in semantics deprives us of some great experiences because we can't just like it or dislike it based on its quality or our personal taste, we pre-judge it partially based on a label that has no real meaning.

 

And history tends to show that the best rock music comes from dark places/troubled souls.

 

I guess that could be true, for the most part, but notice my avatar. No real darkness or trouble there. Music From Big Pink came from 5 guys that reveled in music and the creation of music, and you can hear it.

[mpolak21]

Keep in mind, it's a lot harder to make a great "quiet" album with simple constructs than a sonic thriller. Also, the sheer volume difference between album and live performance accounts for a lot of the difference in excitement....Wilco recorded SBS at their loft, a one-room space, and most of the tunes were cut live with no overdubs. So each of the band members had to tone down their part so as not to drown the others out. This is all pretty well documented.

 

Definitely ironic in that the predecessor (Kicking Television) was "live" but full of overdubs, and had a much more "produced", exciting sound aesthetic. SBS is essentially a real live record, cut flat.

 

Kicking Television had overdubs on it? I know the sound was cleaned up in the studio, but I don't think they added anything to the actual tunes, other than editing.

 

--Mike

[W(TF)]

Kicking Television had overdubs on it? I know the sound was cleaned up in the studio, but I don't think they added anything to the actual tunes, other than editing.

 

--Mike

 

Dunno the details, but that's what I've read many times on this board. I'm sure someone here can fill in the blanks.

[mathew]

SKY BLUE SKY has a friend it

[augurus]

oh no I dont mean they are inferior I still beleive that those two records are the artistic highpoints that those group of guys reached

and I love them insanely what I mean is the dimension of this band doese that to those records for example handshakedrugs with

Nels Cline as opposed to the album version or songs like Kamera or Pot Kettle Black now verus then I mean now there a little anit climatic

while back then they were very exciting but yea its good to hear that more people worship those records it makes me feel a little less insane

I'm sorry, but I must ask.

Do you know how to create a sentence?

[mathew]

well if you mean that literarily then yes I do know how to create a sentence but obviously your referring to another post

and yea I was sort of talking as I was writing so it reads like something I would say not something I sat down to write

I don

[augurus]

well if you mean that literarily then yes I do know how to create a sentence but obviously your referring to another post

and yea I was sort of talking as I was writing so it reads like something I would say not something I sat down to write

I don

[mathew]

well that

[summerteeth091]

gee, i thought i was the only one that thought that!

 

I would agree as well, if it weren't for AM being so slight (yet fun).

 

AGIB is pretty damn boring sometimes, but really does connect on occasion. At Least That's What You Said, Muzzle Of Bees, Handshake Drugs, Wishful Thinking...all amazing, even on the album. Like SBS though, it really connects in a live setting, where it's pretty much impossible to be bored. For the record, Wilco is 50 times more amazing with Cline than without, and it really shows on stage...I'm so glad I saw them now as opposed to 5 years ago.

[hardwood floor]

was wondering if jeff got the phrase "sky blue sky" from the Guided By Voices song Johnny Appleseed, off the Clown Prince of the Menthol Trailer EP

 

the first couplet:

 

You fly like a fly

In a sky blue sky

[lamradio]

Wilco is 50 times more amazing with Cline than without, and it really shows on stage...I'm so glad I saw them now as opposed to 5 years ago.

 

With the Charleston show being rescheduled for August, I start worrying.. "that's a long time from now.. what if they go through another member change.. God forbid, Nels leaves the band..."

 

I seriously doubt that will happen, but still... Nels really has brought Wilco to their prime, and he is hands down brilliant on SBS.

[radiokills]

i would like nothing more than for nels to leave wilco.

[Guest Jules]

i would like nothing more than for nels to leave wilco.

bad day?

[lamradio]

i would like nothing more than for nels to leave wilco.

 

Well, hey, that's your opinion and I respect it. But I think the majority of Wilco listeners like Nels.. IMO, it's hard not to like him if you realize what all he does for the band. Yes, their sound has changed some since he's joined the band, but just think if he was around for the YHF days.. I guess I just like him so much because I'm a guitar head, but I think he does more than just add phenomenal guitar playing, he helped on some of the arrangements for SBS, and I can't wait to see what he does for their next album.

[Sweet Delightful]

I really like Sky Blue Sky. I think comes from a different intention than the last few Wilco albums...in that there is little production on the record. Its literally just them sitting around with microphones. I like to imagine them in a circle in my head, around a metaphoric campfire, just playing.

 

The cool thing about it is that they are still able to make that "Wilco sound" in a more acoustic setting. Not that there is NO production...just alot less layering then, lets say, A Ghost Is Born or Yankeel Hotel Foxtrot, which are epic masterpieces of mastering. Sort of an "I like playing music" album instead of a "my soul is aching to express itself" album.

 

While I do think the songwriting on most of the tracks is exquisite, I agree some of the topics are silly and, I think, are the equivalent to listening to Jeff Tweedy talk about his day. There is one whole song about how he cant function if his wife isn't at home. Its sadly adorable. And another that sounds like Jeff Tweedy taking a walk. Neither are weighty topics, but I think they are still interesting bits of writing. But I could see why the album doesn't grip alot of people...as it is more "Middle of the road" sounding. (Though the guitar solo in Impossible Germany is stunning). Its a bit more peacefully contemplative and not as emotionally gutting or really rocking like other albums.

[mfwahl]

Nels' composing contribution to the instrumental part of You Are My Face should be enough to shut up the naysayers.

He' so es___tia_