zanelotti Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 (edited) A few hours ago I was talking with someone at a local record shop, and this person expressed concern that with JT getting help for his panic/anxiety attacks his music would suffer. I am just dumfounded. The sentiment is absurd (as if pain and sufferring were the essential and ineliminable ingredient in JT's wonderful music, or any art). I am confident that I'm preaching to the choir, but I am really just at a loss. Along the same lines, I was listening to the "Hotel S 'n S" shows today and was really struck by the anxiety continually expressed throughout the same by JT. It brigns to mind some shows where his expressions of anxiety and pre-show panic are met with an odd laughter. Am I alone in sometimes feeling a bit...guilty listening to those shows? Or, maybe I am just being overly sensitive here. Thanks for letting me share Edited July 9, 2006 by zanelotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheelco Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 everyone knows the best musicians just get wasted and die, right Jim, Jimi, Janis, Kurt etc...? I applaud Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cryptique Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 A few hours ago I was talking with someone at a local record shop, and this person expressed concern that with JT getting help for his panic/anxiety attacks his music would suffer. I am just dumfounded. The sentiment is absurd (as if pain and sufferring were the essential and ineliminable ingredient in JT's wonderful music, or any art). I am confident that I'm preaching to the choir, but I am really just at a loss.The sentiment may be absurd (worrying more about someone's music than his health), but I don't think the idea that art is born of pain is absurd at all. History has shown that often the two are inextricably linked. Sure, it's possible to have great art without great pain and suffering, but pain often seems to push people to their creative peaks. Personally, I would rather see Jeff healthy and sane and writing crap songs than continuing to suffer while putting out great music. I'm not saying that I think his songwriting necessarily will suffer because he feels better -- I doubt it will, and I sure hope it doesn't -- but I don't care if it does, because it's more important for him to be healthy than for us to keep enjoying his music. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryan Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 If the new songs are any indication of what he is writing drug-free, then I am happy that Jeff has kicked his habits. The new songs are incredible and get better each night. I feel that the next wilco album will be the best one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 it's more important for him to be healthy than for us to keep enjoying his music.Amen to that It does seem rather odd that one feels most inspired when things are at a low ebb,doesn't it?? Doesn't necessarily have to be that way...as Jerry Garcia was quoted as saying"I'm more interested in what can be created from pure joy" (of course,he was a stone cold junkie for most of his last 20 yrs. on the planet ...talk about a walking contradiction) Scott Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zanelotti Posted July 9, 2006 Author Share Posted July 9, 2006 (edited) Amen to that It does seem rather odd that one feels most inspired when things are at a low ebb,doesn't it?? I agree, it's just that being a human being raises so very many problems in and of itself that you don't necessarilly need have to have a chemical imbalance or behavioral disorder to feel pain! In our best moments, perhaps we are all philosophcial manic-depressives: we take some manner of joy in seeing our sitatuion as it really is (warts and all), yet this produces anxiety and pain in itself. Nietzsche said it best: it is only as an aesthetic phenomena that life can be either tolerated or justified. Whatever that means... Edited July 9, 2006 by zanelotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 While I applaud Jeff and his health, the track record is against him. Billy Joel, Elton John, Eric Clapton, James Taylor are just a few that I can name who have gotten "clean" and their music was not nearly as good as what it was when they where on drugs/mental issues. Now with that being said, I feel Jeff's music will be better than before. He has one thing that they do not, a kick ass band/group. People tend to forget that Jeff Tweedy is a member of a Wilco. He is the driving force "front man" but it sounds like the songs they are working on now are a true collaberate effort. I saw Wilco at Summerfest this year and I say it was the best I have seen Jeff and the best togetherness by the band I have seen in several years. Hopefully Jeff can reverse the notion that after you kick drugs/mental problems you art suffers. I think he can. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 While I applaud Jeff and his health, the track record is against him. Billy Joel, Elton John, Eric Clapton, James Taylor are just a few that I can name who have gotten "clean" and their music was not nearly as good as what it was when they where on drugs/mental issues. Those guys all started to suck way before they got their personal issues in order. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
OOO Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 I just think you have to have a strong emotion to make somthing good. Despair is a strong emotion. But so is outrage, or love, etc, etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 I think every artist draws their inspiration from somewhere different. Despite the archetypal image of the tortured artist, there have also been some pretty great artists who were perfectly content. There's certainly some truth to the assertion that some artists need pain and dispair to do something great, but I don't think that that's universal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RocksOff1039 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 the most geniously expressive musicians are not completely mentally sound anyway. john lennon was a mess. billie joe armstrong suffers from panic disorders and maybe depression. etc etc and so on Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cryptique Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 billie joe armstrong suffers from panic disorders and maybe depression.Bad example. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Floyd Walpole Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 I think every artist draws their inspiration from somewhere different. Despite the archetypal image of the tortured artist, there have also been some pretty great artists who were perfectly content. There's certainly some truth to the assertion that some artists need pain and dispair to do something great, but I don't think that that's universal. Paul McCartney wrote some beautiful music while happy and content with the love of his life, Linda McCartney. I certainly hope that Paul's early life continues to be inspirational to JT. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RocksOff1039 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 Bad example.billie is a genious in his own right. though i expected a reaction like that from a wilco fan. i hate the eyeshadow too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bobbob1313 Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Paul McCartney wrote some beautiful music while happy and content with the love of his life, Linda McCartney. I certainly hope that Paul's early life continues to be inspirational to JT. But Paul had a pretty crappy early life, didn't he? His mom died when he was like, 4 or 5. I think he might have had a brother who died. His dead mother visiting him in a dream inspired him to write "Let It Be". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
caliber66 Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 billie is a genious in his own right. though i expected a reaction like that from a wilco fan. i hate the eyeshadow too. "genius," and it's eyeliner, not eye shadow, as far as i know. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cryptique Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 billie is a genious in his own right. though i expected a reaction like that from a wilco fan. i hate the eyeshadow too.Nice stereotyping. I don't have anything against Green Day in general or Armstrong or particular, but his songwriting is merely average, and he's not someone I'd ever enshrine among "the most geniously [sic] expressive musicians." Quote Link to post Share on other sites
quarter23cd Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Well, its true that some of the most moving art is born out of desperation. Frequently that's what people are drawn to--the unique specticle of an individual opening himself up when he is at his most vulnerable and desperate. Is that healthy? Probably not, but it doesn't make it untrue. Hoping somebody remains unhealthy, tho, because you want to hear a certain type of art created by them--ummm, that's kind of disturbing. Having suffered w/ a panic disorder msyelf, I applaud Jeff if he is indeed as healthy as he seems to be these days. Keep it up, bro! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jdlee23 Posted July 11, 2006 Share Posted July 11, 2006 I'm not sure that a panic disorder would ever contribute to creativity. That seems like an odd link. However, there have been many studies done espousing a great link between manic depression and creativity. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tweedy's Gurl Posted July 11, 2006 Share Posted July 11, 2006 billie is a genious in his own right. though i expected a reaction like that from a wilco fan. i hate the eyeshadow too. a genious indeed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
essox500 Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 You have to be a madman to continue to write edgey, high quality material past your 40's. That's also when most people stop doing drugs or "get more clean". So when people say " they lost it when they stopped doing drugs", it's more like they lost it because your 20's and early 30's are the peak of your creativity in the artistic field of modern rock and pop. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zanelotti Posted July 12, 2006 Author Share Posted July 12, 2006 (edited) when people say " they lost it when they stopped doing drugs", it's more like they lost it because your 20's and early 30's are the peak of your creativity in the artistic field of modern rock and pop. Just my opinion, but there is no comparison between the material JT wrote in his 20s and the material that he has been sharing with us the last few years--I believe he is around 38, so this period is certainly beyond your "early 30s" cutoff. Why exactly do you think that in the "early 30s" artistic merit somewhow diminishes? Why would this happen? What are the reasons? What about the artists who reach their peak after their "early 30s"? Doesn't this give the lie to your statement? Were the last 7 years of Lennon's life the twilight of his artistry? Leonard Cohen? The list could go on... Edited July 12, 2006 by zanelotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 You have to be a madman to continue to write edgey, high quality material past your 40's. That's also when most people stop doing drugs or "get more clean". So when people say " they lost it when they stopped doing drugs", it's more like they lost it because your 20's and early 30's are the peak of your creativity in the artistic field of modern rock and pop.exception:Neil Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gobias Industries Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 going to be an exception: Jeff Tweedy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
guitman Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Those guys all started to suck way before they got their personal issues in order. I would argue that Stevie Ray Vaughan's very brief clean period was better than his drug-addled years. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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