Fear

[Analogman]

Speaking of terrorism - Although I have been skeptical in the past when this sort of thing was mentioned, I saw this last night, and there are most certainly some things shown in this film to make you think: Loose Change.

[fatheadfred]

QUOTE (ryann7739 @ Jul 24 2008, 10:45 AM)

Male, and I don't talk/text on the phone much, I'm always on the computer.

 

Go outside and play. Run! Run like the wind!

 

No, shit, look at us oldies chained to computers seeking an escape to the out of doors. Go destroy something, smoke some dope, steal some candy, do something beside play w/ your technology.

[bobbob1313]

I feel as though the main difference is that the people who are frightening people about global warming, correct or not, believe that what they are saying is true, and are pushing policies that would logically address those issues. The people who have exploited the fear of terrorism have done so in intentionally deceptive ways, and in order to impose an extreme economic ideology in the middle east which does not even theoretically address the causes of terrorism. I just don't see this alternative agenda in the case of the global warming crowd.

 

I would say you are painting with awfully broad strokes here.

 

The pushing of ethanol as a "green" energy source was absolutely a case of an alternative agenda, and it has done a lot more harm than it ever could have done good (not to mention it is no more "green" than regular gasoline).

And many, many companies have taken advantage of "green marketing and have made it into an industry unto itself. I highly doubt that they have altruistic motives.

 

There are good and bad to both sides.

[ryann7739]

Young people are supposed to be liberal. You don't pay taxes yet!

 

Alot of kids in NC are conservative.

 

And yeah, I'm not always on the computer, but I am alot.

[JUDE]

I feel as though the main difference is that the people who are frightening people about global warming, correct or not, believe that what they are saying is true, and are pushing policies that would logically address those issues. The people who have exploited the fear of terrorism have done so in intentionally deceptive ways, and in order to impose an extreme economic ideology in the middle east which does not even theoretically address the causes of terrorism. I just don't see this alternative agenda in the case of the global warming crowd.

 

[M. (hristine]

Here's the thing, as an individual I do as much as I can to behave in environmentally sound ways. In my lifetime I have personally planted hundreds of trees, thousands of green plants and gardens. The acre I live on is an oasis for a billion tiny lives who live without fear of chemicals. I live in a small house, as energy efficient as I can make it. I vote as wisely as I can.

 

I have an old friend who used to say, "Humans have always lived in the most dangerous of times." I don't think I have a false sense of security, nor do I live in fear. Both seem rather naive.

[plasticeyeball]

 

 

i don't get it?

[embiggen]

i don't get it?

 

 

he thinks there is an agenda behind environmentalism.

[bobbob1313]

I took it more along the lines of JUDE finding it ridiculous to say that EVERYONE that believes terrorism is a legitimate threat is doing so only to perpetuate American imperialism in the middle east. OR something.

[embiggen]

you're probably right.

[bobbob1313]

I just think it's pretty impressive the lengths and stretches in logic many people (ON BOTH SIDES) will go to to protect the actions of those they agree with.

 

You want to ignore the fact that there are plenty of people exploiting the environmentalist mood in our country, fine. But don't try to make it seem like they aren't, and don't try to make someone else out to be a bad guy for doing the exact same thing on an issue you don't happen to agree with.

[JUDE]

i don't get it?

 

I'm trying to shift focus away from the greater motives that we neo-cons universally share, i.e. world domination, global corporatization, just generally shifty behavior.

[isadorah]

The pushing of ethanol as a "green" energy source was absolutely a case of an alternative agenda, and it has done a lot more harm than it ever could have done good .

 

what doesn't make sense to me is why we don't re-evaluate our food in light of ethanol putting a dent into the food supply. perfect opportunity to get High Fructose Corn Syrup out of things it really has no business being in. Like the majority of food products most people eat. And we could start feeding cattle and pigs and chickens the food they're supposed to eat instead of corn which isn't actually part of their natural diet. It's such a novel idea. that would free up a lot of food for world hunger and this thing called ethanol.

[embiggen]

[bobbob1313]

what doesn't make sense to me is why we don't re-evaluate our food in light of ethanol putting a dent into the food supply. perfect opportunity to get High Fructose Corn Syrup out of things it really has no business being in. Like the majority of food products most people eat. And we could start feeding cattle and pigs and chickens the food they're supposed to eat instead of corn which isn't actually part of their natural diet. It's such a novel idea. that would free up a lot of food for world hunger and this thing called ethanol.

 

I agree with parts of this, but can't agree with others.

 

On the one hand, it would be super nice to do all of those things, but on the other hand, it would cost a tremendous amount of money to basically change the way food is produced in our country.

 

And I am definitely not in favor of trying to solve world hunger by moving food from where it is to where it isn't. That only perpetuates long term problems in those areas.

 

And corn based ethanol is just a bad idea altogether. It should never have gotten to the point where it is now, but some people stood to make a lot of money by making sure it did.

[plasticeyeball]

he thinks there is an agenda behind environmentalism.

 

 

there can be, and bobbob had a good example.

[plasticeyeball]

I'm trying to shift focus away from the greater motives that we neo-cons universally share, i.e. world domination, global corporatization, just generally shifty behavior.

 

 

just say that next time. or point off in the distance and say "look over there" and i'll forget what we're talking about.

[Party @ the Moontower]

Here's the thing, as an individual I do as much as I can to behave in environmentally sound ways. In my lifetime I have personally planted hundreds of trees, thousands of green plants and gardens. The acre I live on is an oasis for a billion tiny lives who live without fear of chemicals. I live in a small house, as energy efficient as I can make it. I vote as wisely as I can.

 

I have an old friend who used to say, "Humans have always lived in the most dangerous of times." I don't think I have a false sense of security, nor do I live in fear. Both seem rather naive.

 

You sound a lot like me and my family. We have over 700 trees and billions of little creepy crawly things that live a chemical free live on our land. Solar panels, garden, plants, healthy water source....etc. And we are far from rich. I just happened to marry a man with a good brain and nice muscles with amazing ideas that jive with mine.

 

Each person can do something to help this planet. Little things like recycling are important.Just do it.Everyone agrees this is important.You don't need a scientist to tell you that.

[JUDE]

just say that next time. or point off in the distance and say "look over there" and i'll forget what we're talking about.

 

"Oh look, blue car"

[Party @ the Moontower]

what doesn't make sense to me is why we don't re-evaluate our food in light of ethanol putting a dent into the food supply. perfect opportunity to get High Fructose Corn Syrup out of things it really has no business being in. Like the majority of food products most people eat. And we could start feeding cattle and pigs and chickens the food they're supposed to eat instead of corn which isn't actually part of their natural diet. It's such a novel idea. that would free up a lot of food for world hunger and this thing called ethanol.

 

I think most Americans would serioulsy overthrow the government if you took away their high fructose corn syrup.

[isadorah]

On the one hand, it would be super nice to do all of those things, but on the other hand, it would cost a tremendous amount of money to basically change the way food is produced in our country.

 

but think about the amount of money that would be saved in medical costs from diseases such as diabetes and other illnesses that are being caused by the obesity and over consumption of sugar in this country.

 

also, how much money would it cost to reformulate the ingredients of salad dressing or potato chips or granola bars. there are a lot of companies out there manufacturing foods that don't contain unnecessary corn products. if people stopped buying these products, that would force change.

 

what a lot of people don't realize/know is that in recent history corn was introduced as cattle feed as an alternative to a wheat/grass/grazing diet to give a use for the abundance of corn that is grown in this country. it was a way to steer money towards farmers and that morphed into farming corporations for a product that was being produced with no market. a market was created by introducing corn into products that could just as easily be manufactured without it. the idea was cost savings, buy cheap corn to feed your cattle compared to the expense of grazing or feeding hay. you can than increase herd sizes, production numbers, and so forth. it took a while for it to catch on, but it did.

[fatheadfred]

what doesn't make sense to me is why we don't re-evaluate our food in light of ethanol putting a dent into the food supply. perfect opportunity to get High Fructose Corn Syrup out of things it really has no business being in. Like the majority of food products most people eat. And we could start feeding cattle and pigs and chickens the food they're supposed to eat instead of corn which isn't actually part of their natural diet. It's such a novel idea. that would free up a lot of food for world hunger and this thing called ethanol.

 

The corn lobby is a motherfucker. Dems and Reps are in on it so we're f'd.

 

Meat chickens should eat corn and other grain, but not gmo. Egg chickens can eat a range diet w/o corn.

 

I never raised pigs. So I can't speak to that. Thinking about it in the near future, though. Bacon's good.

 

Cattle should not. They do because it allows a 1yr turnaround instead of 2 or more w/ grassfed. It has become more novel recently due to heavy subsidies. Feeders are so used to this fast turnaround that they feed them a lot of waste material now too. Recently they began feeding outdated chewing gum (w/ wrapper). And you probably already know about the meat they feed them (mad cow).

 

Ethanol is dumb. agree. A massive reeducation in farming will have to take place. It has begun on a small scale w/ 'boutique' farmers producing non gmo product that we can eat w/o sending through a factory and the highway.

[bobbob1313]

The problem is the lobbies, no doubt. It sounds sort of silly, but the farming lobby has a lot of weight to push around in Washington.

[sweetheart-mine]

I feel as though the main difference is that the people who are frightening people about global warming, correct or not, believe that what they are saying is true, and are pushing policies that would logically address those issues. The people who have exploited the fear of terrorism have done so in intentionally deceptive ways, and in order to impose an extreme economic ideology in the middle east which does not even theoretically address the causes of terrorism. I just don't see this alternative agenda in the case of the global warming crowd.

that's because they don't have one. well said. it's simple, really. if we don't take care of our home, where will we live? it's strange how some people seem to think this is a version of "the earth is flat." it wasn't flat then and it isn't flat now, but it may end up some non-literal version of flat if more people don't take on some sense of responsible stewardship, and do it with passion.

 

terrorism has been used so outrageously and so often to instill fear for the gain of the very few that it's almost funny, except it's not.

[JUDE]

Oh look, blue car.