The Grateful Dead

[mountain bed]

 

 

I'm glad younger folks are getting into it but it's still hard for me to understand the flat-out high esteemed praise from a lot of folks who've been around the block a few times with these songs. My first reaction was that it's hyperbole, but it's not. C'est la vie.

I agree, totally.

[Lammycat]

I remember walking out of the second to last show in 95, thinking it was a complete joke, and contemplating mailing the band asking for a refund. It was such a complete embarrassment, and I was pissed. Shocked to run into so many people who thought the show was amazing. Listening back now, pretty sure I got that one right. The Visions was great though. Some people just suck at listening to music.

I had tickets to to both Giants Stadium shows summer '95. My gf (at the time) and I gave our tickets for the second night away on the walk out on the first night, it was that weak. Garcia completely fucked up Wharf rat (I realize that this kind of thing happens some times and no one's perfect, etc.) to the point that it was sad, pathetic, and honestly, a little frightening.I was stunned. Listen to it, if you dare. It was like a different tune the first quarter of it. The entire show was just a bummer.It was my last show, too.

[Winston Legthigh]

I had tickets to to both Giants Stadium shows summer '95. My gf (at the time) and I gave our tickets for the second night away on the walk out on the first night, it was that weak. Garcia completely fucked up Wharf rat (I realize that this kind of thing happens some times and no one's perfect, etc.) to the point that it was sad, pathetic, and honestly, a little frightening.I was stunned. Listen to it, if you dare. It was like a different tune the first quarter of it. The entire show was just a bummer.It was my last show, too.

ouch. Just started listening to it now.

 

I'm not quite sure what's going on there. It's not until they sing "the other half found me stumbling around drunk on burgundy wine", right before the time signature change into the waltz, that they find the groove, but is that Jerry's fault?

 

Seems that the drummers weren't in sync with him. Regardless, it was frustrating to listen to. 

[Lammycat]

ouch. Just started listening to it now.

 

I'm not quite sure what's going on there. It's not until they sing "the other half found me stumbling around drunk on burgundy wine", right before the time signature change into the waltz, that they find the groove, but is that Jerry's fault?

 

Seems that the drummers weren't in sync with him. Regardless, it was frustrating to listen to. 

I'll have to listen again but in ,my memory it was Garcia playing so far off the mark that the rest of the band wasn't quite sure what to do....

[Winston Legthigh]

I'll have to listen again but in ,my memory it was Garcia playing so far off the mark that the rest of the band wasn't quite sure what to do....

Your memory is right, pretty much. It's like Garcia is stuck in a loop that you know he's trying to play Wharf Rat, but it's not quite right. My 4 year old will kind of stutter, and repeat the same 2-3 words to the beginning of a sentence as he's trying to figure out the rest of what he's trying to say, and it eventually comes out, but it doesn't take the 6 minutes like the Dead were doing here. 

 

 

But then I can't figure out how they got it all to click in time for the waltz. 

[jw harding]

ouch. Just started listening to it now.

 

I'm not quite sure what's going on there. It's not until they sing "the other half found me stumbling around drunk on burgundy wine", right before the time signature change into the waltz, that they find the groove, but is that Jerry's fault?

 

Seems that the drummers weren't in sync with him. Regardless, it was frustrating to listen to. 

The in-ear monitors in which they all had their own mix with themselves turned up had something to do with it. But probably mainly Garcia.

[Lammycat]

Your memory is right, pretty much. It's like Garcia is stuck in a loop that you know he's trying to play Wharf Rat, but it's not quite right. My 4 year old will kind of stutter, and repeat the same 2-3 words to the beginning of a sentence as he's trying to figure out the rest of what he's trying to say, and it eventually comes out, but it doesn't take the 6 minutes like the Dead were doing here. 

 

 

But then I can't figure out how they got it all to click in time for the waltz. 

It was one of those moments (a long "moment") where people around me and myself were all kind of cringing and awkwardly looking around in bewilderment. I almost felt embarrassed for Garcia. It was sad.

[Winston Legthigh]

It was one of those moments (a long "moment") where people around me and myself were all kind of cringing and awkwardly looking around in bewilderment. I almost felt embarrassed for Garcia. It was sad.

It's really sad. Just like the final "chapter" of the recent GD documentary, which focused on Jerry's decline and demise. The thing that he helped create, with the focus being fun and copious joy, turned into a thing that devoured him.

[Lammycat]

It's really sad. Just like the final "chapter" of the recent GD documentary, which focused on Jerry's decline and demise. The thing that he helped create, with the focus being fun and copious joy, turned into a thing that devoured him.

Totally.

 

re: the in-ear monitors. The band had been using them for several years and, while the playing was sometimes sloppy in parts, I can't fault the in-ear monitors for that. And, certainly not for the train wreck of the above-mentioned Wharf Rat. That was a death call if I ever heard one.

[Shug]

It's really sad. Just like the final "chapter" of the recent GD documentary, which focused on Jerry's decline and demise. The thing that he helped create, with the focus being fun and copious joy, turned into a thing that devoured him.

I agree, but I'll add that Garcia (and the rest of the band to the degree that they chose to keep touring) made the choices, difficult as they may have been, to let opiate addiciton and the weight of responsibility for the Dead scene devour him.  He could have made different choices and ultimately only he is responsible for what he allowed to happen to him.  The fact that it was a choice makes it all the more painful to me.

[Winston Legthigh]

I agree, but I'll add that Garcia (and the rest of the band to the degree that they chose to keep touring) made the choices, difficult as they may have been, to let opiate addiciton and the weight of responsibility for the Dead scene devour him.  He could have made different choices and ultimately only he is responsible for what he allowed to happen to him.  The fact that it was a choice makes it all the more painful to me.

I agree. 

 

But it's also sad that he felt obliged - to the fans, to the Dead business "family" and everyone else whose income was derived from the Dead to keep the train going. Cherry Garcia is continually in our freezer (perhaps not as often as Chubby Hubby, the BEST B&J flavor, but CG is a close second...). Every time I put a pint of CG into my basket, I think about the fact that he contemplated a nice "retirement" fund of living off the ice cream money, and it makes me sad. 

[Shug]

I don't think we can blame fans for wanting to keep having the joy the Dead scene provided.  It is very hard to say "I'm not going to go see the Dead anymore because I don't want to burden Jerry with the feeling of needing to keep touring to keep bringing us joy".  He certainly gave 1000x more joy to so many of us than we could reasonably expect and I will be forever grateful to my core for that.  I just wish he had found a balance, but he was never very good at saying No, he would either just avoid or have someone else say No for him.

 

I'm guessing, as you noted, that a lot of the responsibility he felt was to keep the Dead family (musicians, crew, other staff) employed.  He had a personal relationship with all of them and I can imagine it would be very hard to act knowingly to put them out of a job, even if it destroyed him, which it helped to do.

[Shug]

Aside from what people think about his musicianship and personal life, I admire John Mayer for his sincere passion for the music of the Dead and the way he handles himself in the press these days.  Mayer has passion, positivity and integrity while Chris Robinson has negativity, petty jealousy, and hypocrisy, IMO.  There are a lot of good things that Mayer has to say in this interview, he seems like he is happy and doing things for the right reasons.  I have a lot of respect for him.

 

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/features/john-mayer-on-katy-perry-learning-from-the-dead-embracing-pot-w490230

 

 

Some people are probably jealous of your situation [with the Dead]. Chris Robinson, formerly of the Black Crowes, was just on The Howard Stern Show and took shots at your musicianship. Does that bother you?
I care about this band too much to give that life. I have my thoughts, but it's not my place. I realized not long ago that I'm done debating my own merits: "No, I am very good." Music isn't a sports-page thing to me.

[Winston Legthigh]

I have nothing against John Mayer. His talent is obvious, but his playing does nothing for me. 

 

I caught just the tiniest bit of the 1st set live-thing on youtube last night: It was the Cassidy jam and all of Big Railroad Blues.

 

Now, I am the biggest fan of BRR Blues, especially the one linked to below, which I've mentioned plenty of other times. The version last night was competent, but it certainly didn't have the joy that I can hear in the version below. And maybe that assessment of BRR Blues sums up how I feel about Dead & Co. It's fine. It's competent, it just doesn't get me going.

 

[jackins]

I remember feeling scared and worried in the Spring and Summer of 95. I remember that Wharf Rat being talked about frequently and often referenced as one of the worst shows of the summer. I was fortunate to go out on the RFK shows, which were better, but even the Charlotte show in the spring with Hornsby which is considered one of the best of the year listening to the Scarlet is painful as he mumbles and bumbles.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[calvino]

I enjoy Mayer's playing - for the most part - sometimes his tone bugs me a bit -- he plays a bit much with his toggle switch up -- I keep waiting for him to switch it to the down position, but he rarely does - so a lot of solo's don't have any bite.

He may do this, because he wants to contrast Weir's usual, somewhat metallic tone.

 

I enjoyed the the two times that I saw D & Co , because there was been a lot of energy coming off the stage - something that has been lacking in previous incarnations.

[Lammycat]

I have nothing against John Mayer. His talent is obvious, but his playing does nothing for me. 

 It's competent, it just doesn't get me going.

 

Exactly my sentiments. It's competent music, but it does not stand out in any way for me. 

 

AND, if you have viewed this gif from a show last week, it's really quite funny:

 

https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7btTfWcw0oteONPO/giphy.gif

[Winston Legthigh]

Exactly my sentiments. It's competent music, but it does not stand out in any way for me. 

 

AND, if you have viewed this gif from a show last week, it's really quite funny:

 

https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7btTfWcw0oteONPO/giphy.gif

I don't get it. What's going on in that GIF?

[jw harding]

I have nothing against John Mayer. His talent is obvious, but his playing does nothing for me. 

 

 It's fine. It's competent, it just doesn't get me going.

 

Yup. Good for John Mayer. He's welcome to the party. Can't blame the guy for doing it. I don't care for it. Also don't care for Bobby stepping into Jerry's role as the soul or center of the band, with Mayer in Weir's old role.  The dynamic is fucked up. 

[Lammycat]

I don't get it. What's going on in that GIF?

My guess is Weir is brushing Mayer off as he encroached on his space? but, could be something else...

[jw harding]

My guess is Weir is brushing Mayer off as he encroached on his space? but, could be something else...

Bro's gonna bro

[jw harding]

June 30, 1984 (Indy) shakedown > PITB > Terrapin > Drums > Space > PITB... is a work of art...a masterpiece...

The return to Playin, particularly Garcia's guitar, is excellent. 

[calvino]

i am curious - does anybody really like "Lazy Lightning"? 

[Shug]

You're joking, right?  or you're trying to get the resident Weir proponent (me) all riled up?  Ha ha ha!  I thought I had posted a ways back my treatise on how I think Garica plays better when he doesn't have to sing lead vocals with Lazy Lightning and Let It Grow being two of the best examples? 

 

I love Lazy Lightning, at its best its got the blazing Garcia leads, slashing chords from Weir, a catchy little melodic riff, intricate and precise ensemble playing from the rhythm. section and the keyboards (better in the Brent years, IMO) and a jam that just cooks along like a fast Italian sports car on a winding mountain road.  What's not to like about all that?  I've heard some say they don't like the lyrics, but they don't bother me at all.  Chasing girls is one of the main themes in rock 'n' roll from the earliest days of Chuck Berry and the Sun Studios gang all the way through and Lazy Lightning and Feel Like A Stranger are right in that tradition.  I got no problem with it.

 

Not like its gonna convince anyone who doesn't like the song, but I think the version from Go To Nassau (May 1980) is excellent as is the one from the Greek in '82.

[jw harding]

My wife asked me the other day "does anyone like Lazy Lightning?" I guess the answer is yes. I'll stomach it for the Supplication that follows.