Hold on just one damn minute...

[EL the Famous]

i'd be a liar if i disagreed w/ a lick of that...i still find it impressive he was able to get everybody excited enough to trust that he was the guy to fix it. he didn't always have the lead he did when the thing wound down.

 

i will say 'nice' campaign is an understatement...it was a picture of efficency, organization and marketing at it's finest.

 

again, you are a pessimistic, contrarian sonfofagun, but you are a smart kid. i don't care what tully says.

[Tweedling]

Some black women who work at one of the hospitals I visit said to me this morning, "How ya like us now?!"

 

I kinda laughed and we discussed it a bit, but in the end I felt happy for them. I don't know why, they didn't do a Gawh-damn thang! But I did feel happy for them.

[EL the Famous]

Will someone bump my star status up a bit? How's that work anyway. I've been good haven't I? How does one achieve a 5 star status on VC?

 

skin to win.

[Guest Speed Racer]

i will say 'nice' campaign is an understatement...it was a picture of efficency, organization and marketing at it's finest.

 

Hahahahaha, I was just going to make a comment about how that statement was the political science equivalent of saying, "That iPod thing might catch on..."

[bobbob1313]

Hahahahaha, I was just going to make a comment about how that statement was the political science equivalent of saying, "That iPod thing might catch on..."

 

Well, I was mostly saying that he had the luxury of running a clean campaign. The only reason McCain went dirty was because he was desperate. Obama never had to become desperate, because he had the upper hand throughout the whole thing.

 

I mean, were people ever really worried he wouldn't win? He was never more than a point or two behind at any point and that was with the post convention bump.

[Duck-Billed Catechist]

"'WE WON! WE WON!'

 

'What the fuck did we win? I'm still waiting on my OJ prize!'"

Could it be that the "we" refers to the same "we" as found in phrases like "yes we can?" "We" as in voters, donors, volunteers, staff, and candidate?

[bobbob1313]

Could it be that the "we" refers to the same "we" as found in phrases like "yes we can?" "We" as in voters, donors, volunteers, staff, and candidate?

 

Well, the specific person I'm referring to wasn't exactly heavily involved in the campaign, as far as I know. But, you know. It's certainly possible.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Well, I was mostly saying that he had the luxury of running a clean campaign. The only reason McCain went dirty was because he was desperate. Obama never had to become desperate, because he had the upper hand throughout the whole thing.

 

Obama's honesty has followed him throughout his whole rise - and I'm talking about decades. He disclosed of his drug use in his 1994 book, before he ever held a political office (or, around the same time he first ran?). His short record was cleaner than a new pair of Hanes, and that was intentional. It was a tremendous risk - not a luxury - to throw himself into a race among so many seasoned political veterans. What he lacked on his resume he more than made up for in the way he ran his campaign. I think his ability to run a smooth, state-of-the-art, new-media campaign instilled a lot of trust in voters regarding his ability to choose advisers and take advice. His honesty and his intelligence aren't a luxury, I don't think. I see where you're coming from with that remark, except that McCain spent thirty years as an honest, intelligent senator.

 

Palin was the iceberg to McCain's Titanic; he could have picked Pawlenty or any number of qualified, ferocious candidates, but instead he picked someone whose SNL punch lines were lifted directly from her transcripts. He became the Andy to her Barney. Anyone who would take a career in honesty and trade it for that shouldn't have the luxury of running a country.

 

** quick edit: On the topic of luxuries, Obama has a smile and a wife, neither of which look like he picked them up at the taxidermist on his way home from work.

[bobbob1313]

I think you still misunderstand what I'm saying:

 

Against McCain, he pretty much ran ahead of him the entire time. Most politicians go dirty is if they have to. He never had to throw up that "Palin is a member of a secessionist group" Hail Mary because he was in the lead most of the campaign.

 

Of course, whether or not he would have had he needed to is a question nobody can answer, but being the cynic I am, I'll bet that he would've. He's a politician, and there was too much on the line for him not to do everything he could if it became desperate.

 

I'm talking less about the organization and more about the attacks.

[Lammycat]

B2 makes a good point. Obama was afforded the luxury of the McCain campaign derailing itself. But rest assured, he could've and would've gone ugly if the need arised.

[bobbob1313]

B2 makes a good point. Obama was afforded the luxury of the McCain campaign derailing itself. But rest assured, he could've and would've gone ugly if the need arised.

 

I think everyone but me will disagree with this, but yeah, this is basically my point.

[Guest Speed Racer]

** For the record, I'm getting over one of those head colds where the act of blinking causes thunder claps in my brain, so reading comprehension isn't my strong suit this evening. **

 

B2 makes a good point. Obama was afforded the luxury of the McCain campaign derailing itself. But rest assured, he could've and would've gone ugly if the need arised.

 

And as I said earlier, Obama was handed his initial Senate bid. Literally, the RNC basically wrapped it and slapped a bow on it. The dude's gotten lucky, time and again, no doubt.

 

But my point with the honesty was that he was upfront about any skeletons in his closet before he even ran for office. Politics may have been in the greater plan - in fact I'm sure they were - but he started honest and stayed honest. He absolutely made mistakes in his campaign - the public financing probably being the most notable - but addressed them up front. I guess I prefer to take the more optimistic view, that since he didn't get ugly, we can't speculate about whether he would have or not.

 

What I was saying is that the attacks weren't necessary for Obama because of the organization.

[bobbob1313]

What I was saying is that the attacks weren't necessary for Obama because of the organization.

 

Well, that's another part of it that I've been thinking about. Obviously, I'm going to say that his success had more to do with outside factors, but there's nothing wrong with giving him the credit for it. He did run a mostly mistake free campaign, which was just about all he had to do.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Well, that's another part of it that I've been thinking about. Obviously, I'm going to say that his success had more to do with outside factors, but there's nothing wrong with giving him the credit for it. He did run a mostly mistake free campaign, which was just about all he had to do.

 

But if McCain had run a mistake free campaign, or Obama had floundered too, then attacks from both sides might have been necessary. McCain went for the 2000/2004 model where attack politics were built into the organizational model, but ignored so many other logistical factors. Obama branded himself better than any other politician has ever, and going back to the iPod analogy, almost didn't need to mention the Republican 'Zune' on account of his own cool factor.

[gogo]

for those interested here are the pics my friend took while we walked through the rally. i got some really incredible audio that i will be putting together in the next few weeks.

 

fwiw the man that i'm hugging near the end was a man whose son had been killed in may of last year on a cta bus. he was 17 yrs old & had died saving a friends life. the father spoke about how it would've been his sons first election & how barack had called him to offer his condolences & spoke to him about the violence amongst school aged kids that had been gripping the city at the time. it was powerful stuff.

Allison, that's amazing. Definitely want to hear your audio when it's ready.

[Dude]

Palin thought Africa was a country, not a continent:

 

She also would throw tantrums, refused to prep for Katie Couric, didn't know the US, Canada and Mexico were members of the North American Free Trade Agreement, she took the prank Sarkozy phone call without letting McCain or any of the staff know and proceeded to boast about running for President in 8 years, was told to limit purchases to around $25,000 for six suits and spent the $150,000 on clothing for clothes for the family and purchases of shoes, luggage and jewelry.

 

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics...icas_a_con.html

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/06/us/polit...6mccain.html?hp

 

This is the tip of the iceberg of what is going to be a dirty, ugly account of what they were dealing with when McCain and his cloddish team nominated Palin with no vetting. The outpouring of leaks from staff members and stories about Palin's idiocy should keep us entertained for weeks and hopefully destroy any future chances she has at running for any high office in this country.

[Gobias Industries]

In pretty unrelated news, the South Park episode relating to election aftermath is pretty good.

[Dreamin']

Colbert was amazing tonight. So sharp!

[PigSooie]

i don't doubt that some people did vote for or against him based on that fact,

 

There are more than a couple of folks that voted against him because of his race too, Kev.

[Atticus]

I am honestly very happy for my obama-supporting friends

 

I am disgusted by the things I've seen said about gov. Palin

 

I am disgusted by the things I've seen about the honorable mr mccain.

 

Many of you on this message board have convinced me, through your impassioned rhetoric, to give obama a chance, and I have whole-heartedly agreed to do so.

 

I have agreed to set aside my fears and give this admirable man a chance. He has opened ears in this part of texas.

 

I hope that I can convince others of the same

 

Goodnight obama,

 

I truly wish you the best. I will not delight in your failures.

 

--Neil

[mountain bed]

I'm hoping that this election will serve as the final nail in the coffin for the nostalgic vibe that became known in this country as The Reagan Revolution. The pining for the days when everything was in black and white, including America. When Government was looked at as the problem, not a solution. "Love it or leave it".

 

McCain (and nearly every other Republican incumbent running) invoked Reagan's name in reverential tones at every turn and in the end it had little effect. Finally!

 

I will go to my grave thinking Reagan and his philosophy did more to halt REAL progress for this country than any President in our lifetimes. It seems obvious to me that this party will have to completely re-tool itself or risk becoming an anachronism.

[giraffo]

Obama's honesty has followed him throughout his whole rise - and I'm talking about decades.

 

 

oh like that time he said he wouldn't take public financing or that time he said he'd work with his opponent to ensure campaign spending was kept reasonable as to not empower lobbyists and then outspent his opponent tenfold

 

man, honesty.

 

please, get real. This guy is just another president. I don't dislike him or hope he fails, but jeez, what Kool-Aid are you people drinking? The Republicans spent 8 years being unpopular. A Democrat was likely to take office whether they were white, black, or in HRC's case slightly above mentally ill. He's not going to change anything. He's another president. You guys have heard of somone named Elliot Spitzer right (that was a joke)? He ran his campaign like Obama, based on hope, change, and "day 1" promise. He had the experience--Attorney General who fought for the little guy coming to graciously run the state and eventually the country. Look how well he did. He fumbled, got his ass trounced by Joe Bruno and in an attempt to bring the change he sought did some pretty corrupt shit, and offered illegal aliens driver's licenses. Then he banged a hooker. I wish people would be realistic-- after 6 months to a year this guy is just another crooky politician. Rhetoric will fall to the wayside and you'll see he's just another guy who wanted to be president and was willing to run over people to get there.

 

Also, the fact that people are so excited about his race is hilarious. People want to make all these claims about how gracious and free the US is and then act like it's a big deal a (half)black person is president (Germany, hardly having a history of being free or gracious as we so humbly state we are, has had a female chancellor since 2005). Is it historical? of course. But there's a lot of hypocrisy attached to his race and him in office.

 

Like I said. I don't not want him to win and excite and unite people, but I think everyone should be realistic about him and just understand that he is hardly a beacon of hope and change. He's just another politician. He did the same dirty, moronic things politicians do to get into office. America made the right choice this time (third time IS the charm) but shouldn't misconstrue making the right choice with some kind ofrevolution.

[LouieB]

It's a pretty big deal for a black man to be elected president, when less than 50 years ago we were dealing with...

 

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with the media covering the fact that it's a monumental moment for African-Americans.

Fiinally someone here with some sense..........this is BIG in the African-American community and frankly in the whte community where people still have a memory of the civil rights era. For those that don't this seems like just another politician.

 

LouieB

[bobbob1313]

For those that don't this seems like just another politician.

 

LouieB

 

Is that so bad?

[bjorn_skurj]

You know what? I'm ready to be led for a fucking change. I do not think I am alone in this - there was a lot of talk on the TV today about how this might bring an end to or at least a curtailment of the cut-throat partisanship we have had for the last fucking 20 years. I have high standards about who leads me, and Obama so far has met them, most notably actually being smart enough to be qualified for the most powerful job in the world. If everybody keeps saying everything and everybody is bullshit, everything and everybody will become bullshit. Bush had his moment to lead after 9/11. He most spectacularly did not. Obama has his moment to lead now. I pray to God he seizes it, and I pray to God the American people can come to some sort of consensus on how to get out of the very deep shit we are in.