bleedorange Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 When did releasing tax returns become a big deal for candidates? And why? Link to post Share on other sites
calvino Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 When did releasing tax returns become a big deal for candidates? And why? It started in 1967-8: George Wilcken Romney - go figure. Why? I suppose just for the "full disclosure" reasons. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Romney Romney formally announced on November 18, 1967, at Detroit's Veterans Memorial Building,[181] that he had "decided to fight for and win the Republican nomination and election to the Presidency of the United States."[182] His subsequent release of his federal tax returns – twelve years' worth going back to his time as AMC head – was unprecedented[183] and established a practice that future presidential candidates would follow.[184] He spent the following months campaigning tirelessly, focusing on the New Hampshire primary, the first of the season, and doing all the on-the-ground activities known to that state: greeting workers at factory gates before dawn, having neighborhood meetings in private homes, and stopping at bowling alleys.[185] He returned to Vietnam in December 1967 and made speeches and proposals on the subject, one of which presaged Nixon's eventual policy of Vietnamization.[166][185] For a while, he got an improved response from voters.[186] Link to post Share on other sites
gogo Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Ironically enough, it was George Romney in 1968: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/20/mitt-romney-father-george-romney-_n_1688215.html What that article points out, that many don't, is that Romney released his not publicly, but to a journalist who was writing about him, and was known to be friendly. The journalist summarized Romney's returns and said they looked kosher to him. Apparently Romney knew that his tax returns would be less embarassing than LBJ's, so it seemed like no big deal at the time. What's also interesting is that the reporter writing about George Romney only asked for one year's return, but Romney insisted that one or two years could count as a "fluke", and gave him 12 years instead. Link to post Share on other sites
ih8music Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 I actually take the opposite view. I think it was brilliant (politically) to do so. Yes it puts some pressure on Reid and makes him look like a dick (no real change there). But it keeps the tax return thing in the news. This makes Romney have to continually talk about his tax return and answer questions about it. Romney is out on the campaign trail, whereas Reid is on recess. It was a bold move that is paying off more for the Dems than the GOP. Yes people will get tired of it, and it will eventually go away (I bet about the time the Timmy P is chosen as VP).It is keeping it in the news, yes, but most of what I see is directed at Reid. Link to post Share on other sites
gogo Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 I think Reid's probably OK with that, though. He's willing to take whatever heat comes his way, because in the long run keeping the thought in voters' minds is worth it. Link to post Share on other sites
ih8music Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 When did releasing tax returns become a big deal for candidates? And why? It's mostly just a gesture that the candidate has nothing to hide about his wealth and where it comes from. Yes, started with Romney's dad and is very common now. It even goes down to mayoral candidates in some larger cities (Gavin Newsome released 5 years of returns when he ran for SF mayor). The fact that Romney is refusing is being taken that the "nothing to hide" bit might not be the case for him. Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 http://www.sfgate.co...n-s-3765066.phpGood story, thanks. Ultimately none of this Bain, tax, lying, flip-flopping matters. Most people are going to vote as an ideological or emotional choice, wiith a few folks just puling a lever or marking a ballot at the last minute. Those that think Obama is a socialist,Kenyan, Muslum already have their minds made up and those that think that Romney is a smarmy, vulture capitalist, right wing pig also have their minds made up. The rest? They may not even go vote. LouieB Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Heartbreak Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Good point, Lou.Still, there are some differences between the two, policy-wise...notwithstanding Sparky's comments to the contrary. For example:http://www.washingto...pm_business_pop Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Good story, thanks. Ultimately none of this Bain, tax, lying, flip-flopping matters. Most people are going to vote as an ideological or emotional choice, wiith a few folks just puling a lever or marking a ballot at the last minute. Those that think Obama is a socialist,Kenyan, Muslum already have their minds made up and those that think that Romney is a smarmy, vulture capitalist, right wing pig also have their minds made up. The rest? They may not even go vote. LouieB It is kinda of scary that the future of our country will be ultimately decided by a handful of people who can't make up their minds. Link to post Share on other sites
castaway Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I get that the systems broken and the lesser of two evils blah blah blah.... but most folks are missing the whole point of this election and that is that the next president will be seating maybe three Supreme Court Justices in the next term. They are going to decide the fate of this country over the next twenty years. If a GOP controlled President (they have already said so... We just need somebody to sign the laws!) gets this chance it will set us back 50 years. Goodbye individual hello corporate masters.I'm not thrilled with Obama but he has governed from the center and tried to do what will move the country forward. Link to post Share on other sites
IRememberDBoon Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 The US Senate is an F*edup institution but its made that way so legislative change happens at a glacial pace. Probably a good thing Link to post Share on other sites
uncool2pillow Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 The US Senate is an F*edup institution but its made that way so legislative change happens at a glacial pace. Probably a good thing That's a rather conservative notion. Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I get that the systems broken and the lesser of two evils blah blah blah.... but most folks are missing the whole point of this election and that is that the next president will be seating maybe three Supreme Court Justices in the next term. They are going to decide the fate of this country over the next twenty years. If a GOP controlled President (they have already said so... We just need somebody to sign the laws!) gets this chance it will set us back 50 years. Goodbye individual hello corporate masters.I'm not thrilled with Obama but he has governed from the center and tried to do what will move the country forward.this is the most important reason to vote for Obama. But clearly the center is the new left. LouieB Link to post Share on other sites
lost highway Posted August 9, 2012 Author Share Posted August 9, 2012 http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-august-8-2012/wizards-of-i-d-?xrs=share_copy Here is the Daily Show's take on the voter id controversy. Link to post Share on other sites
The High Heat Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 http://m.cbsnews.com/postwatch.rbml?pageType=video&cbsID=7417492 Not really important to the campaign, but Hillary Clinton is a part of the current administration; really I just love Bob Schieffer's reaction. Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 So yeah, the Pro Obama super PAC came out with the "Romney is a murder ad." Which insinuates Romney and Bain are responsible for a women's death. It is a terrible, horrible ad, and by far one of the worst ads this year. To be fair it is a Super PAC ad which has no coordination/input from a candidate . But what I find is hilarious is that Andrea Saul, a Romney spokeswoman, in her defense of Romney against this ad says, "To that point, if people had been in Massachusetts, under Gov. Romney’s health care plan, they would have had health care." Which is now what Romney and the GOP is trying to get rid of. Mitt Romney's 2012 run for the presidency may just go down as the stupidest in history. It seems like one stupid thing after another. http://www.politico.com/blogs/burns-haberman/2012/08/romney-spokeswoman-uses-mass-health-law-to-respond-131456.html Link to post Share on other sites
Tweedling Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is it possible what may have been appropriate and/or feasible for a state like Massachusetts may not be correct for an entire nation, such as ours? Link to post Share on other sites
lost highway Posted August 10, 2012 Author Share Posted August 10, 2012 That's a reasonable question. All the reasonable answers I could try are: We'll have to try for a while to really find out.Less cautious measures have worked well for other nations.We could not in any decency continue with what was the norm for American health care. It has been an embarrassment for a long time. Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is it possible what may have been appropriate and/or feasible for a state like Massachusetts may not be correct for an entire nation, such as ours? Possible yes, but likely no. The individual mandate is the big thing that the GOP has a problem with. Which is funny since the individual mandate was something promoted by the Heritage Foundation and Newt Gingrich. Needless to say the GOP wants nothing to do ACA and its predecessor that Romney passed in Mass. I really didn't want to get into the debate about ACA again, I wanted to point out the ridiculousness of the Romney campaign. Healthcare was a big thing in Mass and it works. But it so toxic for the GOP any mention of it makes them freak out. Romney has been so co-opted by this notion he needs to be president, I actually think he will run against his true ideals. You see it in all his gaffes, all of his flip flops. For such a seemingly moral person he has no moral center. Changing his mind an opinion constantly. Yes I know ideas and policies evolve, but with Mitt it seems to be too much. Link to post Share on other sites
Tweedling Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I don't really care to debate the healthcare issue too much however, I still believe what we passed is too much too soon. Hell, there are things included in this bill that people, businesses and insurance companies are slowly finding out about now.Not to mention the judge Roberts "switcheroo". I see Obamas campaign doing a lot of Romney bashing and not a lot of bragging on their record. I was also reminded the other day about Obamas pledge to be a 1 term president if he didn't turn things around.... Would anyone say we're moving in the right direction? He mentions all the time that choosing Romney will be going back to past failed policies but are we better off with his policies so far? Link to post Share on other sites
lost highway Posted August 10, 2012 Author Share Posted August 10, 2012 I believe the Obama administration has been helpful in emerging from the economic crisis, just not helpful enough to brag. Everyone knows that he didn't quantitatively succeed in his goals for the economy. I can think of a couple reasons: Obama brought us "Keynes lite". His administration operated under the theory championed by FDR that the government can employ people to make the country more productive and get the economy moving. The administration limited their reach for fear of reproach from the right. Even though the auto bailout, financing "shovel ready" projects, and cash for clunkers were all very successful they did not create a sweeping change for everyone; a lot of people, but not enough to change the national perception. Some people feel that the government just can't make that kind of positive change in an economy. I suppose this is the damned if ya do category. Romney is going to have to campaign really hard on what Obama hasn't done for the economy. He won't be able to sing the Republican Freebird (cut taxes!!) because Obama actually did that. Any theory Romney could put up for how to grow the economy will have to take on some kind of big government initiative. For this reason he'll probably focus on how Obama wants to raise taxes on millionaires and suggest that another term would therefore be disastrous. Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I don't really care to debate the healthcare issue too much however, I still believe what we passed is too much too soon. Hell, there are things included in this bill that people, businesses and insurance companies are slowly finding out about now.Not to mention the judge Roberts "switcheroo".I see Obamas campaign doing a lot of Romney bashing and not a lot of bragging on their record. I was also reminded the other day about Obamas pledge to be a 1 term president if he didn't turn things around.... Would anyone say we're moving in the right direction? He mentions all the time that choosing Romney will be going back to past failed policies but are we better off with his policies so far? Considering that the economic policies of Bush got us into the greatest economic downturn since the great depression, I would say yes we are moving in the right direction. Is it fast enough, no. I think that has to do with the failure of the TEA party wing of the GOP and their inability to compromise on anything. Mitt's economic plan would see millionaires getting at $87K tax cut whereas people making less than 200K would see a $500 tax increase. http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/robert-j-samuelson-romneys-tax-plan-makes-no-sense/2012/08/08/8a5d2096-e16a-11e1-a25e-15067bb31849_story.html Trickle down economics don't work, it never has worked. The economy is moving at a glacial pace, but it is moving in the right direction. Obama has not run on his record as of late, but he has. Romney seemly wants to forget that he was actually governor of Mass. Link to post Share on other sites
Winston Legthigh Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Would anyone say we're moving in the right direction? All indicators for the past two years point to steady growth. Is that not the right direction? Link to post Share on other sites
KevinG Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 So again the GOP is trying to give the election to Romney, either by hook or by crook. http://redsfan.newsvine.com/_news/2012/08/09/13204262-ohio-sets-up-one-early-voting-system-for-republican-counties-another-for-democratic-counties Regardless of your political position, or how you feel about voter fraud, can we all agree what is being done in Ohio right now is a downright shameful tactic by the GOP to have Mitt Romney win? Link to post Share on other sites
Tweedling Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 All indicators for the past two years point to steady growth. Is that not the right direction?Like unemployment? I did not think cash for clunkers was very successful. Maybe I'm wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
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