IATTBYB Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Does this surprise anyone?Yes, I am suprised that Libby was not pardoned. I realize that will happen eventually though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bobbob1313 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Really? We are this angry about this? I mean, he was the fall guy, of course he wasn't going to serve the whole sentence. But somebody had to take the blame. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ponch1028 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Personally, I think Libby got a raw deal and both sides of the political party have abused him as the fall guy. Is he blameless? Certainly not. Was the sentence excessive? I think so. Does this seem fair? If Bush's presidency wasn't such a disaster, I'd think this would be fine. It's when I look at the larger scope of his presidency that it irks me, not because of Libby but rather because of Bush and Cheney. And I am almost certain he will eventually be pardoned. Do I think he should go to prison ... probably not. But I do think he should never be employed with any company that has consistent and direct ties and contact to our government. And any sentencing should have barred him for profitting from his crimes (like an expose book). I'm no fan of Bush or Cheney, but if Libby's biggest crime is taking the heat for crimes committed by the VP, I can't fault him for that, even if I despise Cheney. It's his family that are the real losers here. Just my 2 cents. I'm probably a little inconsistent in my conclusions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cryptique Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 From Salon.com today... Even the lawlessness was lawless The Department of Justice maintains published standards for clemency orders like the one George W. Bush gave Scooter Libby Monday. Under those standards, a request for commutation is supposed to go the Department of Justice's "pardon attorney," who "initiates and directs the necessary investigations and prepares a report and recommendation for submission to the president in every case." As part of those "necessary investigations," the pardon attorney "routinely requests the United States Attorney in the district of conviction to provide comments and recommendations" on the case. As the DOJ standards explain, "The views of the United States Attorney are given considerable weight in determining what recommendations the department should make to the president." The standards also state that that the pardon attorney "routinely requests the United States Attorney to solicit the views and recommendation of the sentencing judge." Oh, and as for timing? The standards are very clear on that: "Requests for commutation generally are not accepted unless and until a person has begun serving that sentence. Nor are commutation requests generally accepted from persons who are presently challenging their convictions or sentences through appeal or other court proceeding." Did the president follow any of these guidelines in commuting Scooter Libby's prison sentence Monday? Not so far as we can tell. He didn't refer the case to the Department of Justice pardon attorney, who therefore didn't consult with Patrick Fitzgerald and didn't ask for an opinion from Judge Reggie Walton. And Bush granted Libby's request -- wait, did Libby even make a request? -- before Libby began serving his sentence and while he was still challenging his conviction. Why didn't Bush follow the guidelines set by his own Justice Department -- guidelines that were meant to put into action the rules laid down by presidential executive orders? Maybe he didn't know they existed. As the Washington Post reports today, the president's gift to Scooter Libby represents the first time he has ever commuted a sentence without consulting the Justice Department at all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MattZ Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 if Libby's biggest crime is taking the heat for crimes committed by the VP, I can't fault him for that, even if I despise Cheney. It's his family that are the real losers here. No. His biggest crime was obstructing justice and lying to investigators in the probe of a leak of classified information. His family? Really? The guy broke the law. He brought this on his own family. The Cheney angle is there without doubt, but Libby made his bed and he doesn't have to sleep in it. Any shame he brought on his family was of his own doing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 The timing of this is 100% due to the fact that much of the country is on vacation this week and not following the news as closely as they would be if he did this next week. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 It never ceases to amaze me how each new day brings with it yet another reason to loathe and detest this administration.You took the words right out of my mouth. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ponch1028 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 No. His biggest crime was obstructing justice and lying to investigators in the probe of a leak of classified information. His family? Really? The guy broke the law. He brought this on his own family. The Cheney angle is there without doubt, but Libby made his bed and he doesn't have to sleep in it. Any shame he brought on his family was of his own doing. Maybe I am being na Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrRain422 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Right, but it's not Bush's responsibility or anyone else's to rectify his family's shame. It his Libby's own duty to do so but accepting his punishment gracefully, and by telling the truth. Every family suffers when someone close to them is convicted of a serious crime, and yet Bush has granted less pardons and commuted less sentences than any president in the last 100 years. Obviously he's not really concerned about that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
W(TF) Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Not surprised at all...and all the more predictable to do it on the week of July 4th when everyone's out shopping for fireworks. Borrows a page from recent Canadian govt's, they love to do that sort of thing. Make an announcement at the end of Friday on a long weekend, adjourn parliament and get the hell out of town. By Tuesday no one cares, including the media. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kidsmoke Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 It never ceases to amaze me how each new day brings with it yet another reason to loathe and detest this administration. Agreed. While this isn't unexpected, my disgust knows no bounds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WilcoFan Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 The real scandal here is not that Scooter Libby got his sentence commuted, or he got a good/bad deal. The real scandal is the slight of hand trick that was so perfectly executed by the Bush administration in once again, defying the law and the will of the people and to avoid having to testify or truthfully come forth to the American public about their actions. Well played. Bravo Bush Administration. Bravo CNN, Fox News, etc. for keeping our eyes on the snowball in the sky while the Bush administration wailed us in the face with another snowball. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chuck Turner Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 I got this in my mailbox today. I thought it was relavant to this thread. Please forgive me if it's outa place, still kinda new here. FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE - SEE WWW.BCIMPEACH.COM FOR FURTHER DETAILSMonday, July 2, 2007Contact: Peter Thottam 310/497-7255 or Byron DeLear 818/974-8964 Attn: Daybook/Assignment Desk Rep. Maxine Waters, former state lawmakers to speak at inauguration of Los AngelesNational Impeachment Center July 4 LOS ANGELES Quote Link to post Share on other sites
isadorah Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 what actually surprised me about this news was receiving an email from the DSCC (ie a group to promote the election of democrats) initiating a petition to send to Bush expressing the people's disgust with the clemency. ummm, when are "they" ever going to figure out petitions and protests fall on deaf ears and mean absolutely nothing to this administration. oh if someone would initiate something that actually would make a difference. don't we have enough grounds for impeachment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anodyne Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 they should pass a non-binding resolution expressing their belief in a petition i am circulating stating the democratic party is completely impotent. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SlowBurn68 Posted July 3, 2007 Author Share Posted July 3, 2007 I think it's fair to say that we demand some kind of action taken on this from our lawmakers. WSJ calls it a "Profile In Non-Courage". We need to impeach this guy for the sake of this country and its image/creditability around the world - Lets make George W. Bush take one for the team... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Atticus Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 I wouldn't hold your breath Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anodyne Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 if anyone knows of a massive protest, please post it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
M. (hristine Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Meanwhile the economy continues to hemorrhage. There are men and women cancerous with power running this fucker. A while back I learned a new phrase, "Yellow Dog Democrat". If the Democrats throw a yellow dog up as their candidate, I'm voting for it. Anything to remove these old boys from office. Bastards can sit on their piles of oily money and rot in hell. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jhh4321 Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 fuck these people im still waiting for the day when i find out that for the past 7 years ive been on the Truman show or something Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SlowBurn68 Posted July 3, 2007 Author Share Posted July 3, 2007 The best thing for "The Right", "The Left", "The Middle", America, and The World, would be to Impeach Both the President and Vice President. There would be nothing but upside, and both parties could then call for early elections. The last thing I would want to see is theses two nut jobs pull the trigger on Iran. Unthinkable! Memo to the Media: Libby Outrage is Not Confined to "the Left" http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huff...y-_b_54845.html Quote Link to post Share on other sites
M. (hristine Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Impeachment proceedings would be damn foolish at this point in the game. The damage is done. Let history be the judge of this debacle. We have plenty to concern ourselves with besides the media melee that would go along with all that. Vote. Pay attention and vote. Faithfully. Locally and nationally. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SlowBurn68 Posted July 4, 2007 Author Share Posted July 4, 2007 Impeachment proceedings would be damn foolish at this point in the game. The damage is done. Let history be the judge of this debacle. We have plenty to concern ourselves with besides the media melee that would go along with all that. Vote. Pay attention and vote. Faithfully. Locally and nationally. I just think impeachment would send a message to the rest of the world that we still have our shit together. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
awatt Posted July 4, 2007 Share Posted July 4, 2007 Hypocrisy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mountain bed Posted July 4, 2007 Share Posted July 4, 2007 I just think impeachment would send a message to the rest of the world that we still have our shit together.Yes indeed. I think it would go a long way to show the world that we can admit it when we're wrong, and we're not afraid to clean up our messes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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