lamradio Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 >i actually hope nels really plays a big role in arrangement this time. he is an untapped treasure in wilco and not just a sideman. given his new release, the new album could be utterly amazing if they let nels go off on tweedy's basic songs. Agreed. Agreed as well.. Although unfortunately some folks don't really get Nels.. Some folk's prefer the more traditional style of guitar playing like Jay produced, and some people just aren't lead guitar heads in general.. But hey you can't please everybody. I personally agree 100% that Nels should be able to completely go off and not hold anything back.. The album would be so amazing that the universe would explode... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
broc Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Have you heard Cline's solo albums? No I haven't and I have no desire to really. I'm not writing off his solo stuff as I've never heard it, I just don't like his contributions to his first Wilco studio album. I thought Cline was a great addition post AGIB, especially on KT but dislike a lot of his noodling on SBS which I've stated here before. I'd like to be proved wrong but we'll see. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lost highway Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 The thing about Nels is you can't really get a good picture of his musical personality (which is way diverse) by looking at his work on SBS. A lot of what he does on that album is in response to the material that was brought to him. If you ever listen to anything start with the Nels Cline Singers, either Draw Breath, or the Giant Pin. It was very interesting for me to hear Nels Cline as a chord player instead of a lead player. He can be very minimal and moody. He can also be a noise maker, he can make a YHF array of noise just with a guitar and effects. Maybe you still won't like it, but I just hate to think anyone would only know Cline's abilities and style from hearing his solo on "Either Way". The man is an onion, full of spicy layers of musicality. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InHiding19 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Man I can not wait for this new album! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dude Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Maybe you still won't like it, but I just hate to think anyone would only know Cline's abilities and style from hearing his solo on "Either Way". The man is an onion, full of spicy layers of musicality. Shrek: Nels is like an onion.Donkey: He stinks? Shrek: Yes. No. Donkey: Oh, he makes you cry. Shrek: No. Donkey: Oh, you leave him out in the sun, he'll get all brown, start sproutin' little white hairs. Shrek: NO. Layers. Onions have layers. Nels has layers. Onions have layers. You get it? They both have layers. [sighs] Donkey: Oh, you both have layers. Oh. You know, not everybody like onions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jff Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 If you ever listen to anything start with the Nels Cline Singers, either Draw Breath, or the Giant Pin. I would also suggest listening to his playing in other bands, like Mike Watt's "Contemplating the Engine Room" and "Ball Hog or Tug-Boat", or Geraldine Fibbers' "Butch", or Carla Bozulich's "Red Headed Stranger". These will give you an idea of how wide ranging his playing is within the context of a rock or country band. SBS is only a narrow representation of what he has to offer, and might not offer much of a clue as to what the next album will sound like. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jesusetc84 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Can great albums only arise from conflict? Some of my favorite albums (YHF, London Calling, the White Album) were rife with conflicts and tension... or at least some kind of creative rivalry of relatively equal footing (Lennon vs. Macca, Strummer vs. Jones, Jagger vs. Richards, Louris vs. Olson, etc.). I almost half-hope there are arguments between Tweedy and Sansone on what keyboard part will end up on the album, and that results in something fractured, tense and exciting musically, but that seems highly unlikely. Maybe these guys love each other TOO much... I tend to agree. It just seems like there's no spark. It's like when you're laying in a hammock and there's no reason for you to get up. You're too relaxed. Sky Blue Sky was a very going through the motions album to me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Edie Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 As for me, I'm going to wait to reseve judgment on the record until I actually hear it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lost highway Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Can great albums only arise from conflict? Some of my favorite albums (YHF, London Calling, the White Album) were rife with conflicts and tension... or at least some kind of creative rivalry of relatively equal footing (Lennon vs. Macca, Strummer vs. Jones, Jagger vs. Richards, Louris vs. Olson, etc.). I think many great albums have, but I don't think all great albums have intense conflict. I suppose any creative venture is bound to have some kind of conflict, but you seem to be pointing towards the dramatic kind. There are some examples of another type of great album: Highway 61 RevisitedKind of Bluethe Crane WIfeGracethe ArgumentThis Year's ModelRevolver I'm not an expert on all of these, I might be dead wrong on a couple, but what I'm getting at are those great albums made by highly capable musicians with a camaraderie found by striving to make great art. I would like to think Wilco has been working with in that kind of atmosphere for the past couple years. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aaron1 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I think many great albums have, but I don't think all great albums have intense conflict. I suppose any creative venture is bound to have some kind of conflict, but you seem to be pointing towards the dramatic kind. There are some examples of another type of great album: Highway 61 RevisitedKind of Bluethe Crane WIfeGracethe ArgumentThis Year's ModelRevolver I'm not an expert on all of these, I might be dead wrong on a couple, but what I'm getting at are those great albums made by highly capable musicians with a camaraderie found by striving to make great art. I would like to think Wilco has been working with in that kind of atmosphere for the past couple years. Did you really just include albums by the Decemberists and Fugazi in a list with Dylan, Miles and the Beatles? I'm a fan of both, but WOW. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Central Scrutinizer Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I can honestly feel certain in saying that of all Wilco's albums the next album will be one of them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
solace Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 As for me, I'm going to wait to reseve judgment on the record until I actually hear it. contrarian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Moss Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I might be the minority on this I have no idea but my favorite Wilco albums are YHF, AGIB, and SBS. I think Jeff does just fine as a songwriter without creative conflict. I don't think all songwriters thrive on it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jff Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I think many great albums have, but I don't think all great albums have intense conflict. I suppose any creative venture is bound to have some kind of conflict, but you seem to be pointing towards the dramatic kind. There are some examples of another type of great album: Kind of Blue I'd be willing to bet that there was at least one person who came within an inch of getting knocked out during the making of every Miles Davis album. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Central Scrutinizer Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I'd be willing to bet that there was at least one person who came within an inch of getting knocked out during the making of every Miles Davis album.Including or excluding Miles Davis? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WilcoFan Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Agreed as well.. Although unfortunately some folks don't really get Nels.. Some folk's prefer the more traditional style of guitar playing like Jay produced, and some people just aren't lead guitar heads in general.. But hey you can't please everybody. I personally agree 100% that Nels should be able to completely go off and not hold anything back.. The album would be so amazing that the universe would explode... What stopped him from doing that in SBS? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wendy Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 What stopped him from doing that in SBS?He paid homage to the songs Jeff wrote. The songs did not lend themselves to this kind of experimentation. He mentioned this exact thing on his website when SBS was released, and also about how satisfied he was with his contributions to the songs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aricandover Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 What stopped him from doing that in SBS? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jff Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 He gave homage to the songs Jeff wrote. The songs did not lend themselves to this kind of experimentation. He mentioned this exact thing on his website when SBS was released, and also about how satisfied he was with his contributions to the songs. Exactly. On the DVD that came with SBS, Tweedy said that he just wanted to do simple straightforward songs for that album. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jff Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Including or excluding Miles Davis? Including. Miles wanted to knock out Thelonious Monk, but he knew Monk could throw him through a wall, so he decided to bottle it up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dude Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I think many great albums have, but I don't think all great albums have intense conflict. I suppose any creative venture is bound to have some kind of conflict, but you seem to be pointing towards the dramatic kind. There are some examples of another type of great album: Highway 61 RevisitedKind of Bluethe Crane WIfeGracethe ArgumentThis Year's ModelRevolver I'm not an expert on all of these, I might be dead wrong on a couple, but what I'm getting at are those great albums made by highly capable musicians with a camaraderie found by striving to make great art. I would like to think Wilco has been working with in that kind of atmosphere for the past couple years. True... Revolver I would argue is competition between two or three songwriters trying to outdo the other, but you raise a great point... I thought of other examples after I posted this, including Bruce Springsteen's entire catalog - I don't really see him having major conflicts with the E Street Band guys, but who knows. There's also a lot of great albums (i.e. Plastic Ono Band, Tonight's the Night, Pink Moon) that are more individuals going through internal struggles versus external. No matter what the source of motivation, I just hope there are some surprises on this new album, and that the songs are pushed in new directions than what we heard on SBS...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ghost of Electricity Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 My favorite Wilco records are (in no particular order) AM, BT, ST, YHF, AGIB, KT, and SBS. I'm just worried that they're going to call the new one "Going Even Through A Lonely If Fertile Eden" or "Leave Off Seldom Eaten Ready Snacks" Incidentally, artistic tension was not one of the reasons Olson left the Jayhawks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LouieB Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I'd be willing to bet that there was at least one person who came within an inch of getting knocked out during the making of every Miles Davis album.Are we comparing Wilco to Miles Davis now? (when does Jeff get to pick out a good wig??) Including or excluding Miles Davis? Good one.... I am kind of hoping the new album comes out tomorrow. LouieB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bleedorange Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 My favorite Wilco records are (in no particular order) AM, BT, ST, YHF, AGIB, KT, and SBS. I'm just worried that they're going to call the new one "Going Even Through A Lonely If Fertile Eden" or "Leave Off Seldom Eaten Ready Snacks" Incidentally, artistic tension was not one of the reasons Olson left the Jayhawks. or Believe Love Over Whatever May Exist Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ZeroCharlie Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Including. Miles wanted to knock out Thelonious Monk, but he knew Monk could throw him through a wall, so he decided to bottle it up.Miles Davis was a genius, but a jerk. He walked off stage when people clapped for a solo from somebody in his band. This was an interruption of his music and he stormed off. My grandfather asked for an autograph from both and he got punched in the face! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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