"Classic" albums you just don't get

[mountain bed]

Not really. Psychedelic music is most definitely a distinct and useful classification. When someone says, "hey, that album is a psychedleic classic", what they are saying is that the album sounds awesome both on psychedelic drugs and stone cold sober. The entire scene was based around hallucinogens, and there was a particular type of music made for that experience by many of the rock bands at that time (and many current ones to this day - see the Flaming Lips as a popular example). The Grateful Dead mixed their records while tripping for the optimum effect. Even the Beatles were working on that angle. It takes more skill to craft a record that works incredibly well on hallucinogens like LSD and also sober. This is why albums like Dark Side of the Moon, Sgt. Peppers and American Beauty have continually captured the imagination of future generations, and still top "best of lists" 40 years down the road.

 

Unless you ever took those kinds of mind altering substances (LSD, mushrooms) while listening to those records, it's difficult to have a full understanding of a psychedelic live performance or record. The description is there for a reason

You make some very good points here. But what constitutes "psychedelic" is so very subjective - and in the time period we're discussing nearly every genre of music was touched by LSD. Who doesn't recall the first time they heard Bitches Brew, or Ascension, or Ravi Shankar, or even something like Leo Kottke's first LP while indulging in hallucinogens? And all of those records work as well to me sober as they did 30 years ago when I was a teenage freak.

 

I don't necessarily agree that the term was purely a marketing tool, but when it became obvious to the "suits" that the "SF Sound" would make some serious money it became pervasive, to the point where nearly all pop music was affected with productional gimmicry that would "replicate the experience".

 

I've often thought that a great idea for a book on the era would start with Pepper and end with DSOTM. those LPs seem to bookend the whole psychedelic rock genre thing for me - by the time DSOTM came out, with its focus on reality (at least lyrically) the whole pipe dream of a new awareness had been co-opted into entertainment. Big Business.

[OOO]

I once started tripping out because I couldn't believe how good the harmonica part was in "Love Me Do." I'm not sure if that adds anything to the discussion.

[Analogman]

Not really. Psychedelic music is most definitely a distinct and useful classification. When someone says, "hey, that album is a psychedleic classic", what they are saying is that the album sounds awesome both on psychedelic drugs and stone cold sober. The entire scene was based around hallucinogens, and there was a particular type of music made for that experience by many of the rock bands at that time (and many current ones to this day - see the Flaming Lips as a popular example). The Grateful Dead mixed their records while tripping for the optimum effect. Even the Beatles were working on that angle. It takes more skill to craft a record that works incredibly well on hallucinogens like LSD and also sober. This is why albums like Dark Side of the Moon, Sgt. Peppers and American Beauty have continually captured the imagination of future generations, and still top "best of lists" 40 years down the road.

 

Unless you ever took those kinds of mind altering substances (LSD, mushrooms) while listening to those records, it's difficult to have a full understanding of a psychedelic live performance or record. The description is there for a reason

 

 

 

I've been listening to that music since I was a kid, and I never call it psychedelic music, or classic rock, for that matter. Some of what you are saying sounds like bullshit to me. And don't give me a lecture about drugs.

[tinnitus photography]

You are completely wrong.

 

you're tripping, aren't you?

[Orkie]

I've been listening to that music since I was a kid, and I never call it psychedelic music, or classic rock, for that matter. Some of what you are saying sounds like bullshit to me. And don't give me a lecture about drugs.

 

 

It sounds like "bullshit" to you because that's your quick emotional reaction to an aspect of that music you've never fully understood or experienced.

[Analogman]

It sounds like "bullshit" to you because that's your quick emotional reaction to an aspect of that music you've never fully understood or experienced.

 

 

I am just saying I don't think one needs to take drugs to enjoy the music. If the only way one can enjoy something is in an altered state, it may be time to re-think what you are doing.

 

Do you think Roger was setting around eating acid when he made Dark Side of The Moon? I am not the Pink Floyd scholar you are, but I would be surprised if he was doing such things. He is too much of a control freak to do that, I would think.

 

And I don't think American Beauty or Workingman's Dead would fall under the category of psychedelic music - far from it.

 

You know what I really think of when I think of that label? I think of copy cat bands using too much flange and those rinky dink keyboard sounds trying to sound groovy.

 

It's just a label - as we always say. Some labels I am into, others I despise.

[uncool2pillow]

I am just saying I don't think one needs to take drugs to enjoy the music. If the only way one can enjoy something is in an altered state, it may be time to re-think what you are doing.

 

Do you think Roger was setting around eating acid when he made Dark Side of The Moon? I am not the Pink Floyd scholar you are, but I would be surprised if he was doing such things. He is too much of a control freak to do that, I would think.

 

And I don't think American Beauty or Workingman's Dead would fall under the category of psychedelic music - far from it.

 

You know what I really think of when I think of that label? I think of copy cat bands using too much flange and those rinky dink keyboard sounds trying to sound groovy.

 

It's just a label - as we always say. Some labels I am into, others I despise.

 

Somebody needs to go and read some of the archives before questioning a-man's musical knowledge...

[dondoboy]

Unless you ever took those kinds of mind altering substances (LSD, mushrooms) while listening to those records, it's difficult to have a full understanding of a psychedelic live performance or record. The description is there for a reason

That's one of the dumbest statements I've ever read.

[Orkie]

That's one of the dumbest statements I've ever read.

 

Your terse, emotional attack response indicates you really haven't experienced this either.

 

Psychedelic records were crafted by people who were tripping, *for* people who were tripping. Other music does not sound nearly as good under that influence. There are certain patterns, sounds, chord changes and effects that create a magical psychedelic experience that other records do not deliver. Had you experienced this,. you would understand that taking psychedelics to Piper at the Gates of Dawn and Stone Temple Pilots Greatest Hits are very far apart in terms of quality while under the influence.

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychedelic_music

 

 

Psychedelic rock evolved in the 60s as an offshoot of the rock and roll movement combining elements of rock, electronic music, eastern influences, and other diverse elements. Inspired by the use of mind altering drugs like cannabis, mescaline, psilocybin, and especially LSD, psychedelic rock broke with traditional rock and laid the roots for krautrock and experimental rock genres of the eighties and nineties. In 1965-1967, The Beatles also were recording psychedelic rock with tracks like "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" and "Tomorrow Never Knows" to name a few, but were not strictly classified as psychedelic rock. Cream and Pink Floyd (with original founder Syd Barrett) embraced psychedelic music fully becoming two of the first truly psychedelic bands.

 

Psychedelic music could also be interpreted as simply a "surreal and dreamy feeling" in a particular song, instead of a specific genre with rules to follow. In some cases, this simply requires writing one coherent song, then to experiment recording that song in the studio while under "psychedelic influence", yielding very surreal musical results. A classic example of this method is "Bass Strings", by Country Joe And The Fish. This early track, written and recorded by Country Joe and the rest of his band in 1966, was obviously an upbeat, hasty, and offensive song of protest in a raw jug band influenced style. In 1967, this song changed dramatically, not to meet more contemporary commercial standards, but rather to re-record it as an experimental track while under the influence of LSD. The new psychedelic result was clearly self-evident in Country Joe's first studio album ("Electric Music for the Mind and Body") when "Bass Strings" featured a much slower tempo, delayed vocals, added reverb, studio reversed cymbals, electric organ, desert traveler lyrics, and a continuous blues guitar solo which together make this song a very, in the true sense of the word, "psychedelic" track.[/i]

[Orkie]

I am just saying I don't think one needs to take drugs to enjoy the music. If the only way one can enjoy something is in an altered state, it may be time to re-think what you are doing.

 

 

While I agree that you shouldn't need drugs to enjoy music, my personal feelings have no relevance to the fact that psychedelic music was created while on LSD and for those using LSD. That's a fact that can't be disputed. And, based on my experience and many others, great psychedelic records are far, far superior to listen to while on mushrooms or LSD. What the truly great bands were able to do is make records that were both brilliant stone cold sober, and brilliant under the use of "enhancement"(and I'm not talking about pot. That makes any music sound better). The bottom line is that if you listen to psych records sober, you are not getting the full intended effect that was built into the record, kind of like buying a large HDTV and not ordering the HD package from your cable provider. That doesn't mean that the shows or games still aren't great, it's just not the full enchilada.

 

Do you think Roger was setting around eating acid when he made Dark Side of The Moon? I am not the Pink Floyd scholar you are, but I would be surprised if he was doing such things. He is too much of a control freak to do that, I would think.

 

No, he was just stoned out of his mind. But what Roger learned, he learned from Syd Barrett (so did all art rock acts). Waters learned to make trippy, "out there" music. By the time Dark Side came around, it was just what they were good at and what came out of them after their great 60's psych pioneering. So in effect, their entire output was based on their experimentation early on, and it's why they wrote one of the greatest psych records of all time in "Wish You Were Here", and dedicated to their founder, Syd Barrett.

 

 

And I don't think American Beauty or Workingman's Dead would fall under the category of psychedelic music - far from it.

 

 

It's the Dead's own unique brand of it, this sort of folksy, cosmic Americana style. The interplay and mixing are key reasons why it's often classified as such. I have heard the album sober and on mushrooms, and I can tell you it's as good as most psych albums in that regard. For example, on "Ripple", there's just much more going on than meets the eye. Guitars are phased in and out, there's little licks popping up all over the stereo field, a bouncy Sgt. Peppers kind of beat bobs along - with Jerry's voice is locked right in the center as all this swirls around that focal point.

[Wendy]

I'd love to see your list of all the albums made while artists were on hallucinogens and specifically designed for listeners on hallucinogens.

[dondoboy]

The bottom line is that if you listen to psych records sober, you are not getting the full intended effect that was built into the record...

Nevermind, this is even sillier.

[Analogman]

I'm not much of Pink Floyd fan - and could never stand the whole Wish You Were Here deal. If you want to talk about dope, I think that album was made for people on downers.

 

What I do like: Fat Old Sun, A Pillow of Winds, Echoes (except for the noise part), Dark Side of The Moon, and the Pompeii film.

[mountain bed]

Cream was a blues band. They jammed, they got 'jazzy', but they weren't "trippy".

[tinnitus photography]

I'd love to see your list of all the albums made while artists were on hallucinogens and specifically designed for listeners on hallucinogens.

 

 

[Analogman]

Cream was a blues band. They jammed, they got 'jazzy', but they weren't "trippy".

 

That's how I see them - always have. Mr. Orkie is right though - if you look them up at Wikipedia, the term psychedelic rock is used in describing them. I think it was due to some of the silly lyrics that Pete Brown wrote with Jack Bruce, the clothing and hair of Eric, and some of the album cover art one finds on two of their albums. But I believe at the heart of the band was the blues, amplified, which is just the way I like it.

 

I believe some of that speaks to what I said earlier - it was about commercial appeal. I doubt Rollin' and Tumblin' was a hit, but, of course, Sunshine of Your Love was.

[Orkie]

Nevermind, this is even sillier.

 

 

You perceive it as "silly" because that's your emotionally defensive reaction to not experiencing or properly understanding that particular topic.

[Orkie]

Cream was a blues band. They jammed, they got 'jazzy', but they weren't "trippy".

 

http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&a...10:kifwxqe5ldde

 

Cream teamed up with producer Felix Pappalardi for their second album, Disraeli Gears, a move that helped push the power trio toward psychedelia and also helped give the album a thematic coherence missing from the debut. This, of course, means that Disraeli Gears gets further away from the pure blues improvisatory troupe they were intended to be, but it does get them to be who they truly are: a massive, innovative power trio. The blues still courses throughout Disraeli Gears

[Guest Hollinger.]

You're an idiot. That's about all I gained from reading this.

 

20 bucks has you as a 17 year old who lives and dies by the 9000 genre classifications on allmusic.

[Orkie]

I'd love to see your list of all the albums made while artists were on hallucinogens and specifically designed for listeners on hallucinogens.

 

 

Almost all of the great rock albums of the late 60's were influenced by LSD.

 

http://home.att.net/~chuckayoub/the_beatles_biography.html

 

In early 1965, Lennon and Harrison were dosed with LSD by their dentist. In the ensuing years, the Beatles met with psychedelic counterculture icon Timothy Leary, experimented extensively with LSD and released two heavily LSD-influenced albums, Revolver and Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band.

 

Jefferson Airplane, John Lennon, Country Joe, The Grateful Dead were among others who wrote songs while on LSD.

 

 

 

 

You're an idiot. That's about all I gained from reading this.

 

 

That is just your hostile reaction to your own insecurities which stem from your lack of experience on this subject matter.

 

 

How LSD rocked the world:

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertai...rld-818714.html

 

Music

 

The combination of flower power and hallucinogenic drugs in Haight-Ashbury in 1967 was as potent as gunpowder and matches. Rockers who'd tried the big blotting-paper experience strove to replicate it in performances that were floaty, spacey, woozy and seemingly without beginning or end. The result was called acid rock: it was supposed to suggest the album had been recorded by a band in the grip of LSD, and was to be listened to by fans similarly stimulated. Lyrics were often minimal, and the sound often relied on randomly wacky special effects, complemented, during live shows, by a light show of wiggly patterns playing against a wall.

 

The Grateful Dead, from San Francisco's Bay Area, were the key US acid rock band; their leader, Jerry Garcia, a portly figure with a prodigious beard, could spin out the solo on "Dark Star" for 25 minutes. Jefferson Airplane also hailed from San Francisco and defined acid rock in 1967 with their album, Surrealistic Pillow. It featured "White Rabbit," which sneakily refers to the apparent drug consumption in Alice's Adventures in Wonderland and ends on the line: "Remember what the Dormouse said: Feed your head, Feed your head." Elsewhere The Doors drew their name from Aldous Huxley's book, and their leader Jim Morrison sang "The End" and "Riders on the Storm" in a blurry, reflective drone, like one intensely drugged.

 

In the UK, 1967 was the year of The Beatles' masterpiece, Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band, whose early highlight was an hallucinogenic vision of tangerine trees and marmalade skies called "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds". The capitalised letters seemed a dead giveaway, but Paul McCartney always denied it was a song about LSD. He later revealed that he'd tried the hallucinogenic, and is thought to be the person who first introduced it to Bob Dylan. The pre-eminent UK acid band was Pink Floyd in the days of Syd Barrett and The Piper at the Gates of Dawn. Their song titles took their cue from space travel – "Astronomy Domine", "Interstellar Overdrive" – as did the Rolling Stones in their single burst of psychedelia, "2000 Light Years From Home".

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychedelic_rock

 

 

Psychedelic rock is a style of rock music that is inspired or influenced by psychedelic culture, or attempts to replicate the mind-altering experiences of hallucinogenic drugs.[1] It emerged during the mid 1960s among garage and folk rock bands in Britain and the United States. Psychedelic rock bridged the transition from early blues-based rock to progressive rock, art rock, experimental rock and heavy metal; and also drew on non-Western sources such as Indian music's ragas and sitars.

 

 

And a big time "must watch" for more understanding on this topic:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO6zOZHpPkk

[Analogman]

I see your point, and actually, the music I listen to the most comes from that time period. I just don't think it's necessary to push the drug issue. I would like to think it was more than that - as a lot of things were going down at the time.

 

And also - we are talking about a very talented group of people, spread over several bands, so something must be said for talent and natural creativity.

[Orkie]

I see your point, and actually, the music I listen to the most comes from that time period. I just don't think it's necessary to push the drug issue. I would like to think it was more than that - as a lot of things were going down at the time.

 

I completely agree.

 

On the other hand, it's foolish for a few here who have never listened to psych records on psych "drugs"(I put that in quotes because mushrooms are now used to get people off of real drugs like cocaine and heroin)

to say that it's "stupid". It's like someone who has never been to Madison Wisconsin telling you how to get to the capitol building, and then reviewing the experience. They should really read more and type less in this specific instance.

 

And also - we are talking about a very talented group of people, spread over several bands, so something must be said for talent and natural creativity.

 

 

Absolutely. A mediocre artist who takes drugs and goes into the studio will mostly likely make a mediocre album. You still have to be able to write really good songs regardless of any other influencing factors.

[mpolak21]

You're an idiot. That's about all I gained from reading this.

 

20 bucks has you as a 17 year old who lives and dies by the 9000 genre classifications on allmusic.

 

Orkie has been gracing us with his vast musical knowledge (the majority of which involve some reiteration of the point The Flaming Lips and Pink Floyd = good; In Rainbows = bad) under various extremely popular screen names since about 2004. Search essox500 in the archives if you ever are bored and want to read some of the most unintentionally funny threads in VC history, such as the Orchestral Reprise AGIB suggestions: If I Had Produced A Ghost is Born

 

If you keep giving him shit, eventually he will bring up the fact that you don't have a girlfriend, swell dude. That said I have never not been sufficiently entertained by a thread with him in it, and our musical tastes are pretty similar.

 

--Mike

[dondoboy]

It's like someone who has never been to Madison Wisconsin telling you how to get to the capitol building, and then reviewing the experience. They should really read more and type less in this specific instance.

There's no one reading this that knows what that means.

[Doug C]

There's no one reading this that knows what that means.

You are wrong dude. That was written to be read while tripping. Ingest some blotter or munch some mushrooms and that sentence will be a veritable Rosetta Stone.