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Black Sabbath and Mot

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There's no question in my mind that Sabbath is the best - at least I'll say that they are my favorite. No one else even comes close. I'll go with Judas Priest as #2, the main reason being I'm not overly familiar with Motorhead.

 

It's a fine line indeed between the hard rock of bands like Purple and Zep, and heavy metal. Here's a good question - who started the genre? Was it the first Jeff Beck Group with lps like Beck-Ola? What about SF's own Blue Cheer? Hendrix? The Stooges?

 

Fuck, I don't know. My metal listening only goes up to about 1980 or so. I tried.

 

::sends out the bat-signal for Aman::

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Although I don't know much about them, Black Sabbath certainly deserves credit as pioneers. I'd also include Led Zeppelin in the same boat as Metal pioneers (along with Deep Purple, probably). For me it doesn't get better than LZ, though. I do appreciate and like Motorhead, as well.

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I don't see Black Sabbath as a metal band - or Motorhead, for that matter. I suppose it depends on who you ask, what book you look at, what year is, what you definition is, etc.

 

I will be surprised if this thread does not turn into a thread full of posts dismissing such music as crap and/or statements referring to Guns N Roses being the best metal band. (They were not a metal band.)

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i always thought that those early 70s "heavy metal" bands might have been heavy for that period, but they're more just riff bands to me

 

 

There is a site out there somewhere - probably mentioned the last time we had this thread - which broke all of this into all sorts of different categories: blues rock, power metal, speed metal, NWOBHW, death metal, hair metal, etc.

 

 

Personally, I would much rather listen to Saw Wings of Destiny, than say albums such as Screaming for Vengeance.

 

 

NWOBHM

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Yeah, "Sad Wings" and "Stained Class" are definitely heavy. Stuff like Victim of Changes and Beyond the

Realms of Death are killer tunes. Around the time of "British Steel" they seem to have made a concious decision to try for a more mainstream appeal. Point of Entry and Screaming continued in that vein. Those are ok records, but nowhere near as good as SWOD or SC.

 

Point of Entry was the last one I bought. We've talked about this before, but Unleashed in the East is a great live record (although I think it had overdubs).

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Here's an extended list.

 

1. Black Sabbath

2. Mot

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My only criterion for what is metal and what is not is the opinion of myself, circa 1983. I can't always describe it, but I know it when I hear it.

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Yeah. For me it might be a few years earlier but I understand what you mean. It could be intelligently argued that most of the stuff I dug in HS in the late seventies was not metal. It seems like the whole idea sort of came after the original Sabbath broke up - when Dio joined Sabbath, and Priest, Maiden, Scorpions etc started to become really big that's when the thing really seemed to take on a life of its own.

 

The shame of all of this is once metal began to become a successful entity you started to have your Def Leppards and whatnot...pop bands taking some of the format and cheesing it up.

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I, like A-MAN, have a tough time trying to pin down what I call metal versus rock n' roll, versus glam rock or whatever. All of that being said if ACDC is metal, then they are #1 for me by miles and miles, up to '79 anyway. Sabbath is right there up until about "Sabotage." If the first VAN Halen is metal, then go ahead and put that right at the top along with the first 4 Maiden, pre-1980 Judas Priest, Motorhead to me was always just a fierce and dirty rock band, but throw them in there as well. As for the past 20 years, I like the first two Helmet albums quite a lot.

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Priest and Sabbath

 

With Iron Maiden and Motorhead getting serious consideration.

 

And as to what it "Metal" -- for me, it's a feel thing.

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Although I don't know much about them, Black Sabbath certainly deserves credit as pioneers. I'd also include Led Zeppelin in the same boat as Metal pioneers (along with Deep Purple, probably). For me it doesn't get better than LZ, though. I do appreciate and like Motorhead, as well.

 

 

I would have to pick three and it would have to be Sabbath, Deep Purple and Zepplin.. They all formed around the same time, so it's hard to tell really which one was the first true metal band, but personally, Zepplin and Deep Purple blow away Sabbath.. I don't even have to say how great LZ was, but Deep Purple's "Machine Head" is probably the greatest metal album of all time.. In my opinion..

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I would have to pick three and it would have to be Sabbath, Deep Purple and Zepplin.. They all formed around the same time, so it's hard to tell really which one was the first true metal band, but personally, Zepplin and Deep Purple blow away Sabbath.. I don't even have to say how great LZ was, but Deep Purple's "Machine Head" is probably the greatest metal album of all time.. In my opinion..

 

I have often read that Jimmy Page hates the fact that they are associated with Heavy Metal.

 

If we are talking musicianship, then it could be that Led Zeppelin and Deep Purple (I mean the Glover/Gillian/Lord/Paice/Blackmore version) are better, but power wise, Black Sabbath beats them all.

 

Do you think someone could get the guitar sound Tony created on Volume 4 today? I think not.

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I have often read that Jimmy Page hates the fact that they are associated with Heavy Metal.

 

Same with Deep Purple.. They classified themselves as more pop rock. In those days, those bands were definitely considered Metal.. Or at least Hard Rock..

 

No one could come close to the guitar sound on Volume 4. Now days, the Metal guitar sound is nothing but digitized garbage..

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Same with Deep Purple.. They classified themselves as more pop rock. In those days, those bands were definitely considered Metal.. Or at least Hard Rock..

 

No one could come close to the guitar sound on Volume 4. Now days, the Metal guitar sound is nothing but digitized garbage..

 

 

I sometimes call it - Blues Power Rock.

 

Yes, so called nu-metal is crap. Although, there are several million people that would disagree with that statement, of course.

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Blues Power Rock. That's a pretty apt description. LZ and DP are definitely blues-based, moreso than some of the others mentioned. Many of the melodies of the metal bands have an almost classical feel to them.

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