The Grateful Dead

[Lammycat]

He was on again-off gain with the drugs. Likely as most people are that have addictions.

[worldrecordplayer]

I was losing touch with the Dead around '79 or '80, became totally bored with the Dead around '81, and stopped seeing them until fall '87, so I missed that entire period. I've never been impressed with any shows that I've heard from that era, though I know lots of friends and folks around these parts who saw great shows.  I think Jerry and the Dead had a golden age from '87 through '91.  From '92 on, it was a long, slow death spiral.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

I was losing touch with the Dead around '79 or '80, became totally bored with the Dead around '81, and stopped seeing them until fall '87, so I missed that entire period. I've never been impressed with any shows that I've heard from that era, though I know lots of friends and folks around these parts who saw great shows.  I think Jerry and the Dead had a golden age from '87 through '91.  From '92 on, it was a long, slow death spiral.

Check out 10/9/82 & 10/10/82, the Frost Ampitheatre shows, if you haven't already heard 'em.

[Oil Can Boyd]

I was losing touch with the Dead around '79 or '80, became totally bored with the Dead around '81, and stopped seeing them until fall '87,

That's funny - that is the exact opposite of my timeline of interest in them.  I started paying attention to them in '79, became pretty obsessed with them around '81, and saw them for the last time in '86.

[NoJ]

Check out 10/9/82 & 10/10/82, the Frost Ampitheatre shows, if you haven't already heard 'em.

Yeah, wasnt it "Rango K" or something like that who made those recordings? Great AUDs. I was listening to those over the weekend while doing more chores....this time it was patching the gaping crack in the concrete floor of my screenporch.

 

Btw, I know a guy who RAVES about the GD in 83-84.

[Lammycat]

 They never had a bad era, imo, but eras that were better than others. I wouldn't exactly call the summer '95 tour an "era," anyway. Garcia seemed to age/devolve pretty quickly from the end of '94 until the last show.

 

There are still gems of shows after '90, just more far and few between. I can name many nuggets from any era/year that are worth listens, even '95. The band was evolving/changing up until the end with new tunes and shit. I never understood how a fan could write off entire eras. Seems silly to me to neglect oneself, but to each their own.

And, '83 was an awesome year for the the band, imo.

[worldrecordplayer]

 There are still gems of shows after '90, just more far and few between.

MSG September '90 and Boston September '91 were complete run gems.  

[worldrecordplayer]

 I never understood how a fan could write off entire eras. Seems silly to me to neglect oneself, but to each their own.

And, '83 was an awesome year for the the band, imo.

It was easy.  I had been listening/seeing the Dead since '73, by '81 I was simply bored with what they were doing (I couldn't stand to listen to another mid-tempo NFA), perhaps in contrast to all the other music that was happening in my life from '77 on.  I started listening to the Heads and Elvis and Clash and Ramones and Television (the list is endless) around '77-'78, moved to Boston in '79, and the music scene was so happening in Boston those years, until the mid to late '80's.  I distinctly remember that I could not believe that my friends were still going to Dead shows!  Then I went to Providence in '87, and then to the last of the '87 MSG run the next week or so, and I was blown away.  It all sounded fresh again.  I needed the time away, and I believe my time away (and what moved me to get off the bus in the first place ) coincided with a significant downer opium period for Garcia. It also took that amount of time and break for me to get used to Brent.  I've still never heard a show from the '81-'85 era that grabbed me (really nothing after Cape Cod in October '79), but I'll give some shows another listen.

That's funny - that is the exact opposite of my timeline of interest in them.  I started paying attention to them in '79, became pretty obsessed with them around '81, and saw them for the last time in '86.

put the two of us together and we've got it all covered!

[Mr. Heartbreak]

I wouldn't actually say I have ever written off an entire era of Dead, but my "go-to" stuff is mainly from '69 to about '83. If someone directs me to an outstanding performance, I'll check it out, but I won't sit down and listen to an entire show from towards the end. It just really, really bums me out, 'cause I loved ol' Jer. Maybe I'm just a pussy.

[imsjry]

I wouldn't actually say I have ever written off an entire era of Dead, but my "go-to" stuff is mainly from '69 to about '83. If someone directs me to an outstanding performance, I'll check it out, but I won't sit down and listen to an entire show from towards the end. It just really, really bums me out, 'cause I loved ol' Jer. Maybe I'm just a pussy.

 

Owning hundreds of shows in various formats, my favorite thing to do now is go the their main Archive.org page and select "shows on this day in history" and just randomly play stuff from the shows that pop up. They had good shows and bad, but there are always gems to be had in each show in each year. Amazing band.....no doubt.

[Lammycat]

I can't honestly think of one show that ws "bad," top to bottom, save for (possibly) my last one at Giant's in '95. There were always good things out of mediocre shows, even.

[imsjry]

I can't honestly think of one show that ws "bad," top to bottom, save for (possibly) my last one at Giant's in '95. There were always good things out of mediocre shows, even.

 

I always think about the last shows at Soldier Field in '95. Jerry was completely gone for 99% of them but then he pulled off that Visions of Johanna (7-8) and the So Many Roads (7-9). Two of the best vocals I've ever heard him do. So bittersweet.......

[mountain bed]

 They never had a bad era, imo, but eras that were better than others. I wouldn't exactly call the summer '95 tour an "era," anyway. Garcia seemed to age/devolve pretty quickly from the end of '94 until the last show.

 

There are still gems of shows after '90, just more far and few between. I can name many nuggets from any era/year that are worth listens, even '95. The band was evolving/changing up until the end with new tunes and shit. I never understood how a fan could write off entire eras. Seems silly to me to neglect oneself, but to each their own.

And, '83 was an awesome year for the the band, imo.

This. There are VERY few "perfect" shows, and there are very few "bummer start to finish" shows as well. There are shows, entire tours even, that seem to lack in the magic department, but the thing is we always appreciate a good try. That's why we're Heads. Sometimes the clams are some of my favorite parts - it just shows that they're human. Hell, if I wanted perfection every night I'd go on tour with The Egos (I mean Eagles  ). AND - if anyone ever hears of me doing that PLEASE KILL ME. 

[calvino]

Owning hundreds of shows in various formats, my favorite thing to do now is go the their main Archive.org page and select "shows on this day in history" and just randomly play stuff from the shows that pop up. They had good shows and bad, but there are always gems to be had in each show in each year. Amazing band.....no doubt.

 

I do this quite often, too. Yesterday I listened to a decent show from Seattle Center Coliseum on 1983-08-27 - I must admit I always enjoy Little Red Rooster as a song, but not Brent's bit about the hen house and such - it's all a bit too much.

 

Today it's the below - Howard Wales sits in and no Weir and Pigpen.

 

Band Mickey And The Hartbeats

Venue Family Dog at the Great Highway

Location San Francisco, CA

Date 8/28/69 - Thursday

 

 

One [1:20:59] ; It's A Sin [7:38] ; [0:31] ; Hi-Heeled Sneakers [6:56] ; [1:46] ; Dark Star [31:21# + #15:58] > The Eleven Jam [9:49] > Dark Star [6:43]

 

Comments Bear's cassette master is labeled Hartbeats. The band is Garcia, Kreutzmann, Hart, Lesh, and Howard Wales on keyboards. The keyboards are very forward in the mix to start with. The mix is rather bad for the first 20-25 minutes but then improves ; the left channel drops out briefly twice while this remix is being done..

 

Dark Star evolves into a series of Jams, with the keyboard prominent, particularly at first. There is probably a minute or so missing at the flip and they are working a rather different riff (in the same key) when Side B resumes, but there is basic continuity between the two sides. Plainly the 16 minute Jam beginning Side B is an extension of the Dark Star Jam that breaks off at the end of Side A. As they move back out of The Eleven Jam Phil works a funkified variant on the Dark Star theme to announce the return.

 

The Eleven Jam analyzes: ... Jam > The Eleven Jam 8:57 > Eleven 2nd theme Jam 0:52 > Dark Star ...

 

[Vacant Horizon]

Jerry's voice seemed to abruptly go to shit at the end of 82.  From there on out, it was an acquired taste, right?  For me it was.  His guitar plying remained stellar until 1992.  I found myself not just missing the voice, but also solos that weren't just blips on the guitar.  I rmember Richfield summer '92 and Garcia not really playing any real solos in the first sets.  Just random notes.  I really questioned my irrational need to see as many shows as I could.  That being said, there were good moments at each show...all subjective, no doubt (or an amazing set like Philly spring 94 I think).  These moments became less and less until the end.  My last show was Pittsburgh 95.  It was fun, but not good.  Interestingly, or cosmically, me and all my best touring buddies somehow converged for that show.  A symbolic ending for us.

 

What I find really interesting is that off stage, Garcia seemed totally normal.  Interviews from that era show him spry and talkative.  It's like he took some sort of downer before hitting the stage and just slept standing up.  It's too bad.  Garcia band and Grisman stuff was always good.  Reading Blair's book, it seems that if he had done more of that stuff closer to home and less Dead, the whole thing might've gotten better and lasted longer.  I personally don't think the band gave a shit about him or the sound.  I mean, they hired Welnick who, god bless him, did not belong and cheesed up the joint.

[Lammycat]

Voice went to shit in '82?! His voice was pretty high and whiny at times in '82, '83 and was different from '69 or '77 or whatever but I don't think it went to shit, and certainly not permanently. Listen to JGB shit, too, in 87, 88, 89. The guy sounds crisp, for the most part. Sometimes I think I'm crazy when I hear stuff like his voice becoming an acquired taste at the end of '82. I wonder if people who caught them in the late 60s thought the same afterJerry stopped singing with that weird trilly waver in his voice and exaggerated tone in his voice....

[tongue-tied lightning]

i'd have to go back and hear a late 80's show. I don't remember saying that Jerry's voice went bad.

 

what is the feeling about Donna ? just listened to a 1977 Fire, and her singing pretty much ruins it.

 

i'm on the fence on whether i like Brent.

[Vacant Horizon]

Voice went to shit in '82?! His voice was pretty high and whiny at times in '82, '83 and was different from '69 or '77 or whatever but I don't think it went to shit, and certainly not permanently. Listen to JGB shit, too, in 87, 88, 89. The guy sounds crisp, for the most part. Sometimes I think I'm crazy when I hear stuff like his voice becoming an acquired taste at the end of '82. I wonder if people who caught them in the late 60s thought the same afterJerry stopped singing with that weird trilly waver in his voice and exaggerated tone in his voice....

 

Your comment is nothing short of astounding to me.  Listen to a 70s show and then late 80s show.  His voice gone and, to me, sounds like shit.

[Lammycat]

Your comment is nothing short of astounding to me.  Listen to a 70s show and then late 80s show.  His voice gone and, to me, sounds like shit.

The man aged! The voice changed just as it did from the 60s to the 70s. I wouldn't classify it as turning to shit/gone, but ear of the beholder. I guess it doesn't bother me as much as others, but I always found it endearing that he was still doing what he did. 

[Vacant Horizon]

The man aged! The voice changed just as it did from the 60s to the 70s. I wouldn't classify it as turning to shit/gone, but ear of the beholder. I guess it doesn't bother me as much as others, but I always found it endearing that he was still doing what he did. 

 

I see where your coming from.  Yes, the man aged, but he aged quite drastically and quickly as soon as he turned 40.  At least to these ears.  Drugs, the road...all that.  Good point about changes from the 60s through 70s.  It's amazing how all these legacy bands started out as Beatle clones and morphed into 'themselves'.  The Dead being a great example.

[calvino]

Regarding Jerry's voice, I imagine drugs and weight gain had more to due with the change of his singing voice, than aging. I read about him practicing his guitar all the time, but I haven't read much about how he kept his voice in shape.

 

Some nights were better then others, for sure.

[Skian]

I see where your coming from.  Yes, the man aged, but he aged quite drastically and quickly as soon as he turned 40.  At least to these ears.  Drugs, the road...all that.  Good point about changes from the 60s through 70s.  It's amazing how all these legacy bands started out as Beatle clones and morphed into 'themselves'.  The Dead being a great example.

Don't forget he smoked Camel unfiltered too. I'm sure that was not a 2-3 smokes a day habit. That does not leave a smooth velvety coating on the throat.

[worldrecordplayer]

what is the feeling about Donna ? just listened to a 1977 Fire, and her singing pretty much ruins it.

 

i'm on the fence on whether i like Brent.

I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority on this, but I always liked Donna's singing.  I liked it at the time, I was always willing to admit that part of the appeal was watching her on stage swaying that long hair and imagining what I could do with that !  But I still like her singing listening to the recordings.  People complain about her being out of tune and wailing, etc, but I don't see that.  And it took me a very long time to get used to Brent's singing (and playing) after Keith and Donna were gone. 

[NoJ]

Donna is/was great, I dont mind her at all.

 

WIth Brent, the thing that annoyed me was the "tinkly tinkly" sound he used sometimes. I much prefered when he went with the B3 hammond sound.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

I love Donna, but only when she's not off-key or "flat."

Brent was great when he was on the B3 for sure, and his singing brought a different dimension to the band. But honestly, Keith was always my favorite keyboard player of all the eras. Sure, he was a non-factor in the late 70s, but listen to anything from the peak years of '72-'74. That is some great stuff, especially the boogie woogie piano style on songs like Mississippi Half Step and Ramble on Rose, or the jazzier playing on a good Chinacat > Rider. The guy was awesome for a time there.