The Grateful Dead

[NoJ]

And Deal.....Jerry loved that song. He played it ALL the time in the GD and JGB. I've just heard it way too many times, including just last night.

[worldrecordplayer]

Cue to "Ramble on Rose" and it's on that "track" after the song ends. Fantastic stage banter:

https://archive.org/details/gd71-10-30.prefm.nawrocki.26608.sbeok.shnf/gd1971-10-30d2t06.shn

Funny thing is, they do Truckin after all.

These fall '71 FM tour shows are all great.

 

https://archive.org/details/gd71-10-30.prefm.nawrocki.26608.sbeok.shnf/gd1971-10-30d2t07.shn

[Lammycat]

If any of you mentioning the 3.1.80 JGB show, the Early show and the Late show are both available on video, too. Well worth the watch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idUIhfmOkfI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FYqzYqlRqw

Funny thing is, they do Truckin after all.

These fall '71 FM tour shows are all great.

 

https://archive.org/details/gd71-10-30.prefm.nawrocki.26608.sbeok.shnf/gd1971-10-30d2t07.shn

Yeah, they cave in.

[worldrecordplayer]

Anyone listening to the JGB 11/23/91 release? Holy crap, A+++ recording. I attended the night before at the Hosemont, seats behind the stage.

I've been sitting on getting that, thanks for the reminder, just ordered it.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

You obviously aren't listening to it correctly. I get excited upon the first note or 2 of the song just thinking about the potential enormity in the jam part of the tune (like on that 11.23.91 show!).

I think that "enormity" you like is the "devolution" I referred to earlier.

Just goes to show, with the Dead, there is a lot to love...and something for everyone. Even among hardcore 'heads, one man's trash is another man's treasure.

By the way, anyone else here admit to skipping pretty much every Drums>Space? I might tune into an occasional Space (like to hear the transition into The Wheel or something cool), but I skip every drum solo for sure. It still baffles me that it took until the 80s for the Dead to start using what was the bane of just about every rock show in the 70s: the drum solo.

[NoJ]

Drums/space was fine when listened to while there. I always skip it when listening to recordings.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

Drums/space was fine when listened to while there. I always skip it when listening to recordings.

Now that I'm over 50, I would appreciate it as a much-needed piss break, but at the time I was at those shows, it was more like a "let's-spark-up-another" break.

[jw harding]

Deal is one of the few tunes that improved in the Brent era. Started out as a laid back groove, they turned it into a ripper. There is a version from one of the video releases, 89, then nearly always gets me to fall out of my chair.

[Lammycat]

Deal is one of the few tunes that improved in the Brent era. Started out as a laid back groove, they turned it into a ripper. There is a version from one of the video releases, 89, then nearly always gets me to fall out of my chair.

Yessir!! The Alpine one on Downhill from Here. 

[Mr. Heartbreak]

Deal is one of the few tunes that improved in the Brent era. Started out as a laid back groove, they turned it into a ripper. There is a version from one of the video releases, 89, then nearly always gets me to fall out of my chair.

Yeah, I think my relative lack of enthusiasm for Deal comes from having a bit of "first-time-heard" syndrome: I heard early versions first, and felt that's the way the song should be, a kind of shuffling, laid-back groove. When it got sped up, I wasn't crazy about that, and the incendiary guitar work didn't really make up for it, for me. I feel the same way about Sugaree. Lot's of folks love the 17-minute versions from later years, where Jerry would play these cascades of notes, but I always liked the straight ahead versions from the early 70s best. Different strokes.

 

It's interesting to see what people list as all-timers on headyversion.com. I've discovered, and re-discovered, some great versions of tunes that way. I have also dipped my toe into some late 80s to early 90s Dead and pulled back quickly when the Jerry croak came in. I know people love Eyes of the World with Branford Marsalis, for example, but to me it was a pale shadow of the 73-74 versions of that song. And so on. Eyes is actually another good example, for me, of a song that got sped up like Deal did, and didn't benefit from it, IMHO.

[Lammycat]

Speaking of different (early vs later) versions of tunes, "Bertha" is a weird one as it had a pretty rockin' tempo from the get-go, then slowed down quite a bit in 77-79, and then picked up tempo again in the 80s. I'd be willing to wager that the shifts in tempo had, at least in part, something to do with speedy drugs....Though apparently this had an opposite affect on TLEO.

[Mr. Heartbreak]

Speaking of different (early vs later) versions of tunes, "Bertha" is a weird one as it had a pretty rockin' tempo from the get-go, then slowed down quite a bit in 77-79, and then picked up tempo again in the 80s. I'd be willing to wager that the shifts in tempo had, at least in part, something to do with speedy drugs....Though apparently this had an opposite affect on TLEO.

 

Yup. Funny how that works on the listener, at least in my case. I prefer the tempo of TLEO on the Reflections album, though I do like the early, even speedier versions. I don't like the later ones, which I found excruciatingly slow.

 

I love Bertha circa 1971-1972, and was bummed by the sort of reggae versions even during the "peak" of '77. I bet you're right, it did have something to do with chemical amusement.

[calvino]

I believe the below is the full Billboard article that A-Man posted a couple of days ago -- actually it looks like a completely different one. At least the authors are different.

 

 

http://www.billboard.com/articles/news/7717115/grateful-dead-50th-anniversary-backstage-pass

 

Still doesn't mentioned if they actually paid for the masters or not.

 

Last May, 30 years after the original auction, a few of those tapes from the band's fabled 1978 run at Red Rocks in Colorado were sourced for July 1978: The Complete Recordings. However, explains Pinkus, that box was "a one-off," good-faith deal. "At that point, it was very up in the air if a deal for all of the Betty Boards would ever happen. The overall deal was closed in late 2016 and tapes were brought straight to Burbank upon signing to begin ... ­cleaning them up and getting them to Jeffrey Norman to begin the mastering. If the deal would have closed any later, we would have missed the 40th anniversary of Cornell."

 

[jw harding]

It's a different one.

[i'm only sleeping]

Anyone listening to the JGB 11/23/91 release? Holy crap, A+++ recording. I attended the night before at the Hosemont, seats behind the stage.

It's f*** fantastic. the best of the last JGB releases imho. And Jerry is at his most heartfelt voice...Check it in Shining Star...till my dying day. Goosebumps.

 

Er, by the way...I use to skip Mountains of the Moon, a few of Jerry tunes I do that. Sorry, Mr Heartbreak! 

[Shug]

It's f*** fantastic. the best of the last JGB releases imho. And Jerry is at his most heartfelt voice...Check it in Shining Star...till my dying day. Goosebumps.

 

Er, by the way...I use to skip Mountains of the Moon, a few of Jerry tunes I do that. Sorry, Mr Heartbreak! 

I'm still waiting for this to arrive, but I am stoked to hear all these good reviews!  JGB was peaking around this time, I'd say.  The most longstanding lineup with quite a few years under their collective belts by this time and lots of good new covers entering the repertoire.  Can't wait to get it, thinking about having a full volume listening party for my local Head friends when it gets here.

[Shug]

As for the Dead tunes I don't care for, I think the issue for me is not so much the tunes as how they were played, as others have mentioned.

 

Take Truckin' from 7-18-72 and compare it to any version from the 80s and 90s.  When they played it great, I never get tired of it.  When they play it weak, I wish they'd retire it.   https://archive.org/details/gd1972-07-18.sbd.theotherwayne.88658.sbefail.shnf/GD72-07-18D3T02.shn

 

Franklin's Tower in '77 and '79 was usually epic, but by the late 80s it could be plodding and uninspired.  Same for Sugaree.  Those repetive Jerry tunes (Franklin's, Sugaree, Fire On the Mountain, Deal) that did not have a lot of rhythmic or chording complexity needed epic solos and rhythm-based crescendos to be hot, IMO.  When Jerry and/or the rhythm section weren't killing it, these tunes could be really boring.  I agree, Deal got better in the late 80s, but Sugaree and Franklin's did not.  Neither did Mississippi Half Step, which for me peaked in '77 (9-3-77 Englishtown being the pinnacle!)

[Mr. Heartbreak]

As for the Dead tunes I don't care for, I think the issue for me is not so much the tunes as how they were played, as others have mentioned.

 

Take Truckin' from 7-18-72 and compare it to any version from the 80s and 90s.  When they played it great, I never get tired of it.  When they play it weak, I wish they'd retire it.   https://archive.org/details/gd1972-07-18.sbd.theotherwayne.88658.sbefail.shnf/GD72-07-18D3T02.shn

 

Franklin's Tower in '77 and '79 was usually epic, but by the late 80s it could be plodding and uninspired.  Same for Sugaree.  Those repetive Jerry tunes (Franklin's, Sugaree, Fire On the Mountain, Deal) that did not have a lot of rhythmic or chording complexity needed epic solos and rhythm-based crescendos to be hot, IMO.  When Jerry and/or the rhythm section weren't killing it, these tunes could be really boring.  I agree, Deal got better in the late 80s, but Sugaree and Franklin's did not.  Neither did Mississippi Half Step, which for me peaked in '77 (9-3-77 Englishtown being the pinnacle!)

 

I guess I should have done a better job defining what I meant when I wrote the phrase "aren't too crazy about." I mean, I like all these songs I mention - Deal, Tennessee Jed, Dark Star - I just don't love them at the same level I love certain other Dead tunes (Fire on the Mountain is another good example...I love that tune).

 

The great thing about this thread is that, like checking headyversion.com, it can instantly inspire someone to check out something suggested by another poster. The 7/18/72 is probably my all-time favorite show, so I'm not going to go there, but I will proceed post haste to review the Englishtown Half-Step. Haven't heard it in a while!

[jw harding]

Agree with various sentiments on Truckin. Is there any tune that saw a greater decline than Truckin? From bluesy jam masterpiece, to anthemic cliche?

 

China Cat really started to shit the bed after 74, particularly when Bob pretty much quit playing his intro licks, and they lost the feelin' groovy transition into Rider. Rider always delivered though.

[uncool2pillow]

Franklin's Tower was mentioned in the post that started this discussion. It's the repetitiveness of it that I like. It has kind of a Sweet Jane vibe. In fact, I've kind of fantasized about the Dead doing Sweet Jane and/or VU doing Franklin's Tower.

[Lammycat]

Franklin's Tower was mentioned in the post that started this discussion. It's the repetitiveness of it that I like. It has kind of a Sweet Jane vibe. In fact, I've kind of fantasized about the Dead doing Sweet Jane and/or VU doing Franklin's Tower.

Listened to a show last night (Rosemont 4.13.88, mostly because I wanted to re-visit the Sugar Mags, Bertha 2nd set opener) and when we got to the 3rd tune of 1st set, here comes "Franklin's". Great tune, of course, man did this one sound off: too fast and too slow at the same time, if that's even possible.

 

When the first notes struck, my wife was getting on one of those stationary bikes and commented something like" "Great, a peddling song!" It was some awkward peddling, to say the least.

[jw harding]

Listening to Set 2 from 3/17/94, St. Patrick's Day in Chicago (Rosemont). Freshman year Spring Break for me. The night before is probably better, with one of the better setlists of the era. But the playing is solid at this show too. Rosemont thru Richfield in Spring 94 was a strong 5 show run. Jerry flubs were low, some high points, solid setlists and playing throughout.

 

https://archive.org/details/gd94-03-17.sbd.ladner.8023.sbeok.shnf/gd94-03-17d1t01.shn

[Vacant Horizon]

Listening to Set 2 from 3/17/94, St. Patrick's Day in Chicago (Rosemont). Freshman year Spring Break for me. The night before is probably better, with one of the better setlists of the era. But the playing is solid at this show too. Rosemont thru Richfield in Spring 94 was a strong 5 show run. Jerry flubs were low, some high points, solid setlists and playing throughout.

 

https://archive.org/details/gd94-03-17.sbd.ladner.8023.sbeok.shnf/gd94-03-17d1t01.shn

That first night was probably one of the better shows I saw. Definitely a highlight of 94. Way To Go Home>Dark Star...LOL

 

Richfield had 'the best Stella ever' right? That weird pre drums with Picasso and Victim. I really liked the first set that night. The SBD really sounds good. Peggy-O was a stand out.

[calvino]

I was at the 1st two Rosemont shows in 94, too. The only two times that I saw them at an indoor venue. The venue always sucked but it was an okay two shows for me. Had fun.

The Spring, 94 shows were vastly superior to the Summer, 94 shows that I saw.

[NoJ]

I saw the 3/16/94 show. I recall them skirting around Dark Star but not actually doing it. Surprised to see it listed as such. All this time, cursing that I never got to hear a DS live.....I'll have to listen to this again.