Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

[Analogman]

Well,  NIN, Kraftwerk, and The Smiths all blow. Besides, no one has really even heard any of "Kraftwerks" tunes before. Or any tunes by NIN, come to think of it, besides that tune "Hurt" (that Johnny Cash did a nice job on) or that one where they're like la la la "help me" la la la. So, hard to have a serious discussion about the merit of one band being more "influential" or having a "better" body of work over another when no one has even heard the music of some of these "bands".

 

I always thought NIN made music for serial killers and psychopaths. (Joke) 

 

But - I guess whoever voted for those people have their reasons. I don't agree with most of the list this year. 

[suites]

Overall the list is pretty good...would have like to see some of the "Class Rock Bands" get some (Yes, DP, Cheap Trick, Moody's, CHicago.....).

 

I would trade out Withers and Sting for Steve Miller and Warren Zevon.

 

Also Heavy Metal we need some in there....Def Lep......

 

Green Day is a lock that is for sure.

[worldrecordplayer]

I honestly don't see it.  There was a time in my life where I went to a ton of Phish shows and listened to everyone of their albums, and traded bootlegs of various shows.  I loved Phish.  Though truth be told I grew out of that phase in my life.  

 

In short they are a great band.   But HOF material?  The eligibility requirements are vague and subjective (even more so then sports and other HOFs).  I suppose we could argue and argue if they are or are not and never change anyone's mind.  

 

But let's play the game of picking the top five out of this years nominees, assuming you see Phish as HOF worthy, who you gonna leave out of your top 5?  

 

For me my top 5 would be:  NIN, NWA, the Smiths, Lou Reed, and Kraftwerk.  There is no way Phish has a greater influence or better body of work then those 5.  

First, I admit I have no idea what the criteria is for nomination/admission.  But the fact that Joan Jett is on the list of nominees is probably the zillionth example that the whole thing is suspect.  And I'm sure I can go through the list of actual inductees and find many more in the Joan Jett category.

 

But whatever the criteria are or should be, I have no problem making the case for Phish.  I won't bore you and everyone with it here, not my mission to try to influence anyone (not that I could), I'm sure you know what I would say before I even say it.  Not only do I love the band, the musicianship is off the hook great.  But anyhow...

 

To get to your question, who would I vote for assuming Phish were on the list: Phish, Lou, Green Day and SRV definitely get my votes.

 

I don't get Kraftwerk, or NIN, but my personal tastes aside (from what I know of NIN/Trent, I can't stand them), have a hard time seeing how they are worthy.  I'm likely totally ignorant, but how much of a body of work do they have?  NIN in particular may have an enthusiastic following, but a very small one.  Anyhow, I don't see it for either band.  I think it's an easy argument that Phish has a better body of work than Kraftwerk, NIN and the Smiths (how many great songs do they have?)  if that's how you're setting up the decision tree.

[KevinG]

First, I admit I have no idea what the criteria is for nomination/admission.  But the fact that Joan Jett is on the list of nominees is probably the zillionth example that the whole thing is suspect.  And I'm sure I can go through the list of actual inductees and find many more in the Joan Jett category.

 

But whatever the criteria are or should be, I have no problem making the case for Phish.  I won't bore you and everyone with it here, not my mission to try to influence anyone (not that I could), I'm sure you know what I would say before I even say it.  Not only do I love the band, the musicianship is off the hook great.  But anyhow...

 

To get to your question, who would I vote for assuming Phish were on the list: Phish, Lou, Green Day and SRV definitely get my votes.

 

I don't get Kraftwerk, or NIN, but my personal tastes aside (from what I know of NIN/Trent, I can't stand them), have a hard time seeing how they are worthy.  I'm likely totally ignorant, but how much of a body of work do they have?  NIN in particular may have an enthusiastic following, but a very small one.  Anyhow, I don't see it for either band.  I think it's an easy argument that Phish has a better body of work than Kraftwerk, NIN and the Smiths (how many great songs do they have?)  if that's how you're setting up the decision tree.

 

Here is the Induction Process from the RnR HOF website.

 

https://rockhall.com/inductees/induction-process/

 

The problem with RnR HOF in general is that music is so subjective.  If you hate a band you will say they are not HOF worthy, if you love a band you will see them as HOF material.  There really is no perspective, no hard numbers to deal with.  If we do that, is Taylor Swift HOF in 20 plus years?  

 

Really if anything the RnR HOF is about as un RnR as you can get.  

[Moss]

 My list of 5 based on a combination of personal preference and  percieved (by me) impact on music.  Completely meaningless and uninteresting to everyone including myself which pretty much sums up the entire HOF induction process.

 

Stevie Ray Vaughn (of course)

The Smiths

Lou Reed

Bill Withers

Kraftwerk

[Analogman]

I have to go for Bill since he is from my home state.

[uncool2pillow]

Lou's solo record is sketchy, but he should make it for Transformer, Berlin, Blue Mask, New York, and his general influence on the indie scene.

[The Inside of Outside]

Lou's solo record is sketchy, but he should make it for Transformer, Berlin, Blue Mask, New York, and his general influence on the indie scene.

That sounds about right. Add in SRV, and maybe, maybe, The Smiths, and that's about all I'd support in that list.

 

When I think of the HOF in a sport, I think of the very, very best in their sport at their time. Dwight Evans and Alan Trammell - not the very, very best of their time. There were a number of better players when they played - that is why they are not in. Really, really good players, but not Hall of Famers. I know sports are different; they have stats, playoffs, etc. to help judge a player. That said, The Paul Butterfield Blues Band? That's Dwight Evans right there. War? There is your Alan Trammell. The Spinners? Dick Allen. Joan Jett? Think Dave Stieb. And maybe not even that good, frankly.

 

Not a great list this year. At this point,it would be great if they were wrapping up the older acts, and be focusing most of their energy on the acts that put out their first records in 89 and the years just prior.

[tinnitus photography]

Well,  NIN, Kraftwerk, and The Smiths all blow.

you are obviously a well-rounded and highly studied music fan.

 

 

 

Kraftwerk are basically the Beatles of non-guitar music.

[tinnitus photography]

I don't get Kraftwerk, or NIN, but my personal tastes aside (from what I know of NIN/Trent, I can't stand them), have a hard time seeing how they are worthy.  I'm likely totally ignorant, but how much of a body of work do they have?  NIN in particular may have an enthusiastic following, but a very small one.  Anyhow, I don't see it for either band.  I think it's an easy argument that Phish has a better body of work than Kraftwerk, NIN and the Smiths (how many great songs do they have?)  if that's how you're setting up the decision tree.

your jam band roots are showing through.

 

I realize that those bands are not in your regular listening rotation, but in particular The Smiths were absolute titans of creating an aesthetic (visual and sonic) that's pretty much been unmatched.

[worldrecordplayer]

your jam band roots are showing through.

 

I realize that those bands are not in your regular listening rotation, but in particular The Smiths were absolute titans of creating an aesthetic (visual and sonic) that's pretty much been unmatched.

 

My childhood roots were what would now be called "jamband" oriented, and I have returned to a lot of those roots, but I lived in Boston in the late '70's and '80's and spent all my musical energies on non jam band music interests. I was pretty familiar with The Smiths for a little while during their early Meat is Murder and next album period, but no doubt I lost touch and interest in them after that. Morrissey really annoys me, in the same way Bono annoys lots of folks. When I think about bands that created an unmatched visual and sonic aesthetic over a measurable period of time, I think of The Cure, or Joy Division/New Order, or the Heads during their Stop Making Sense era. As for NIN or Kraftwerk, yes, they have never been in any of my listening rotation at any point. But just because I don't like their music (what little of it I've heard) doesn't mean I don't think they are not worthy of the HOF, I just don't think they are HOF bands whether I like them or not.

 

 

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[worldrecordplayer]

Consequence of Sound republished their 2013 list of the 20 Biggest HOF snubs.

 

http://consequenceofsound.net/2014/10/the-20-worst-rock-and-roll-hall-of-fame-snubs/full-post/

 

To Tim's point, The Smiths come in at number 3. "Accolades: Without netting much in the way of Grammys or similar industry nods (sans a few NME awards), the band is often cited as a pioneer of the subsequent Britpop explosion, influencing bands like Oasis, the Stone Roses, and more. The BBC once called The Smiths “the band that inspired deeper devotion than any British group since The Beatles."

 

To my point, Phish is on the list as well.

 

 

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[mountain bed]

Another year - no Deep Purple, no Yes. Christ.

[worldrecordplayer]

Another year - no Deep Purple, no Yes. Christ.

But somehow Joan Jett gets on the list.

 

 

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[LouieB]

No Warren Zevon.

 

LouieB

[KevinG]

No Warren Zevon.

 

LouieB

 

That is a snub, if there ever was one.  Warren Zevon, the Ronnie Santo of Rock n Roll Hall of Fame.  

 

Except Ron Santo is in the HOF

[Lammycat]

you are obviously a well-rounded and highly studied music fan.

 

 

 

Kraftwerk are basically the Beatles of non-guitar music.

Isn't my face red for not realizing a German art-synth-crap band from the 80s are The Beatles of my time. Isn't it the 2nd or 3rd time they've been on the ballot to the quirky R&R HOF ballot? Maybe I'm not so alone on this one. 

[Lammycat]

If they let Kraftwerk in, I'd assume they would eventually have to let The Beatles in, too....

[suites]

Another year - no Deep Purple, no Yes. Christ.

They were both nominated last year and did not get the votes...A guy from Yes said they were 20 votes short....guess the Nom Com did not want them back on ballot this year....next year I bet for at least 1 of them.  IN fact DP was nominated 2 years in a row.

 

I agree with you guys on Zevon....bad snub

[moxiebean]

But somehow Joan Jett gets on the list.

 

 

...but The Runaways don't.

 

It really is a popularity contest.

[Atticus]

The Smiths and Phish are no brainers, regardless of how long it takes to get them in. Both established singular sounds, both are influential. Anyone who thinks Phish were just noodling dead wannabes never actually listened to the music of either band.

 

Lou Reed gets insane props for his VU contribution but apart from New York his solo material is sketchy. I have no problem with him getting in individually though as he is an icon of rock.

[ih8music]

I think a case can be made for Joan Jett as one of the first prominent female rockers. Her influence on rocker girls of the 80s is hard to dismiss.

 

Then again, this is the RRHOF so I have no clue how the votes will land. The replacements didn't get in last year and aren't even nominees this year.

[tinnitus photography]

Consequence of Sound republished their 2013 list of the 20 Biggest HOF snubs.

 

http://consequenceofsound.net/2014/10/the-20-worst-rock-and-roll-hall-of-fame-snubs/full-post/

 

To Tim's point, The Smiths come in at number 3. "Accolades: Without netting much in the way of Grammys or similar industry nods (sans a few NME awards), the band is often cited as a pioneer of the subsequent Britpop explosion, influencing bands like Oasis, the Stone Roses, and more. The BBC once called The Smiths “the band that inspired deeper devotion than any British group since The Beatles."

 

To my point, Phish is on the list as well.

 

 

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Smiths were #3, Phish were #20. i win

[tinnitus photography]

Isn't my face red for not realizing a German art-synth-crap band from the 80s are The Beatles of my time. Isn't it the 2nd or 3rd time they've been on the ballot to the quirky R&R HOF ballot? Maybe I'm not so alone on this one. 

if you want to dismiss an entire branch of music as 'art-synth-crap' that's your right. but get one thing right, mr old man - they are not of 'your time.'

 

i bet you are a big hip-hop fan, too.

[Lammycat]

if you want to dismiss an entire branch of music as 'art-synth-crap' that's your right. but get one thing right, mr old man - they are not of 'your time.'

 

i bet you are a big hip-hop fan, too.

Ha. When was "my time"? And yes, I have no problem dismissing an entire branch of music I find lame, because I can. I do like some Hip-Hop type stuff like Tribe Called Quest, De La Soul, Jurassic 5, and such, too. Good stuff, imo. Which is what it all boils down to, anyway.Maybe that's my time....?